NOM

I'm stalking Reddit for the promised leak, but I'm also fantasizing what it would take to really make a huge impact - what would be the biggest type of leak we could imagine?

Any thoughts?

Something that happened after a big beer?

I'd say leaking church finances would be big.

nibbler wrote:Something that happened after a big beer?

Yeah, like from those tall bottles that cost way too much.

Let's keep in mind that the LDS church already produced 13 essays and the church did not subsequently collapse. LDS leadership has been properly circumspect about the details of any issue. They are admirably focused more on their core message than on answering the charges of bitter apostates. The strategy is simply to make the critics present the compelling case about the church. Don't expect the First Presidency to publicly explain the details and rules of polygamy, for example. Instead, the LDS church will only minimize the problems and publicly focus on their ecclesiastic goals.

A big leak would need to be something that top leadership actually faced head on and took up as an issue. A public apostasy of an outspoken apostle might do it. I'm not convinced that a major financial leak would do it, however. Church defenders could simply say that the LDS church is well managed from the business side and this supports their spiritual goals. City Creek certainly affects some people. But Joseph Smith started this tradition of virtual intermingling of tithing money and business interests. This continues today and will be explained as simply business practices that help fund spiritual goals.

Silver Girl wrote:what would be the biggest type of leak we could imagine?

Any thoughts?

All of the top 15 are "Confirmed Homosexuals"?


(I"m curious what a homosexual confirmation looks like. Could one of you COB lurkers "leak" a video of that?)

Church lawsuits with info on settlements and fines. Especially child abuse lawsuits...

Well this thread could get fun!

I don't think there's much that could shake the members. SO much can just be dusted off as the imperfections of men without ever pinning it to any particular man just a bunch of men who work for COB. Real convenient.

I do think it would shake many if it were revealed that: Members of the Q15 secretly practicing polygamy with multiple living women.

I think the critical aspect of a big leak is it has to be something important enough to non-members in order to attract the attention of of the entire nation. Not just make the papers, but actually attract attention. In addition to attracting national attention, it has to be something that casts mormons in an extremely unfavorable light. Basically, right now most places you can still be a mormon and be pretty well accepted in mainstream culture. Certainly there are groups and individuals that don't like mormons, but I've never really had any negative social impacts because of being mormon. The leak has to be big enough and embarrassing enough that TBMs can't just ignore it.

I think the previous example of the leaders still practicing polygamy (among living spouses) is a great example. I think some kind of serious, illegal tax evasion would be another example. Also as another poster mentioned, cover ups of sexual abuse by church leaders would fit the bill. Possibly video leaks of the apostles engaging in extremely unchristlike behavior (ie if there was video evidence of them speaking in the same manner as Trump does about issues (sorry for bringing in politics, but it was the best example I could come up with)).

trophywife26.2 wrote:I do think it would shake many if it were revealed that: Members of the Q15 secretly practicing polygamy with multiple living women.

Sure, but just imagine what the apologetics would look like if secret polygamy showed up. Senior apostles quietly married off some aging (and some not so aging) spinsters. They simply claim that these are marriages for religious reasons only and no "married, filing jointly" tax advantages were ever done. Further claims are that this is what God actually wants them to do and this is not some radical new marital arrangement that will be rolled out to the membership. Everyone is being financially supported privately and no tithing funds are being spent for these marriages.

The outside world sees some old men and old ladies somewhat living together and shrug. Non-Mormons continue to ignore the church in favor of elections, NFL games, and "Westworld". Evangelicals never really liked us anyway despite our ardent support of Prop 8 in California. Apologists glower at all the apostates who have failed to gain a testimony of this eternal principle. Your stake president rolls his eyes and assures you that they've always known this principle and don't expect it will be rolled out to the ward level. Elderly temple workers look around the endowment session knowingly.

That's how this would turn out. I think it will take a financial catastrophe like Enron or Lehman Brothers for the LDS church to really collapse.

Some hot mike, Access Hollywood type video.

(Could you imagine if Joseph Smith were around during the time of video cameras and hot mikes? Actually, it might not be that hard to imagine. Praise to the man...)

I'd love for the Leaky Video Releases guy to post a few that have discussions on why and how the Q-15 finally decided to publish some of the truth. It certainly didn't come from a sudden attack of conscience or a desire to Choose the Right in serving church members. Maybe there's a hidden nugget with some real data about church membership numbers.

What if the discussions leading up to the essays had an unmistakable CYA tone? What if there were videos of Oaks fretting about lawsuits? What if there were videos of them reviewing and sanitizing some of the essays (such as trying to hide the math in how they phrased Helen Mar Kimball's age)?

Maybe there are discussions about how the Internet has forced their hands on the history? If so - there might even be discussions about why it was in the "best interest" of the corporation to hide the truth for, oh, about 185 years or so. That would be so, so rich. Oooh - here's a good one - how about some videos of discussions on who is rich enough to get promoted to a Red Chair?

One fantasy that would give me personal satisfaction would probably backfire in terms of upsetting the TBM handcarts - I wonder if there are videos of serious financial discussion like, "Our revenues are down - time to make the members do the toilets!" But, if there were videos making it clear the church was losing money, the TBMs would double down on increasing what they give each month.

Corsair wrote:

trophywife26.2 wrote:I do think it would shake many if it were revealed that: Members of the Q15 secretly practicing polygamy with multiple living women.

Sure, but just imagine what the apologetics would look like if secret polygamy showed up. Senior apostles quietly married off some aging (and some not so aging) spinsters. They simply claim that these are marriages for religious reasons only and no "married, filing jointly" tax advantages were ever done. Further claims are that this is what God actually wants them to do and this is not some radical new marital arrangement that will be rolled out to the membership. Everyone is being financially supported privately and no tithing funds are being spent for these marriages.

The outside world sees some old men and old ladies somewhat living together and shrug. Non-Mormons continue to ignore the church in favor of elections, NFL games, and "Westworld". Evangelicals never really liked us anyway despite our ardent support of Prop 8 in California. Apologists glower at all the apostates who have failed to gain a testimony of this eternal principle. Your stake president rolls his eyes and assures you that they've always known this principle and don't expect it will be rolled out to the ward level. Elderly temple workers look around the endowment session knowingly.

That's how this would turn out. I think it will take a financial catastrophe like Enron or Lehman Brothers for the LDS church to really collapse.

Good points so I guess I'd have to say it would shake the members if the Q15 were practicing polygamy with significantly younger women. It wouldn't even have to be teenagers like JS/BY but just women in their 20s or even 30s would look really odd/be uncomfortable for TBMs to see especially if the women were attractive so they couldn't play it off as the apostle was just helping the poor unmarried woman gain celestial glory but a woman who was a real catch (dare I say a trophy wife ) who had plenty of prospects.

Anyway that's just highly unlikely so might as well drop this silly line of thinking. Or is it unlikely??? Look at what Brigham and Joseph did. I don't think they could hide that in this day and age.

Trophy Wife - that would be a very entertaining leak. I can't see that happening at the Q-15 level (I could be wrong) - but I could see it happening at a lower level of leadership.

Here's an idea your post gave me - how about a video that shows discussions on who gets to have their PH blessings restored after being ex'd? We have all heard numerous stories about pedophiles who still get back into the temple, etc. So - how in the heck did that happen?