NOM

Haggoth's conference thread got me thinking about the format for gen. conference and why it is so bad.

At work, I do a lot to develop training programs for employees and new hires. There is a surprising amount of psychology that we have been using to refine our training programs to make them more effective.

For example, for general instruction, a person can only really concentrate on a take for 45 minutes reliably. It's recommended that a person then change tasks to something not as mentally involved for 15 minutes before going back to the previous task. After 45-50 minutes their attention drops rapidly. Fur those 15 minutes, it is rendered that some physical movement is helpful to get a person's mind to reset.

If you are doing detailed instruction, it is recommended that training sessions should be no more than 10-15 minutes. The shorter the better.

Conference seams to take all that is known about effective teaching and throws it out the window.

People simply don't pay attention to someone talking for 2 hours. They zone out half way through and are not able to reliably concentrate. Even doing a "rest hymn" in there won't help. It's too short and standing up isn't enough movement and chance of pace to help a person regain concentration. On top of that, you have multiple sessions basically back to back. 6 hours on a Saturday at the worst. 10 hours nonstop of you watch all the fluff between sessions. And it's not just GC. SC is the same bad format.

ON top of that, teaching is best done when it engages as many senses and different media as possible. Again, the system they use is setup to fail. having nothing but a talking head for 2 hours with no change to the format is a sure fire way to loose someone's attention.

The result of this teaching style is that nothing sinks in.

So to me, this begs the question of why do they use such an obviously ineffective teaching method? Inertia? This is how they always did it and can't/won't change? Is it intentional to give a excuse to spend the next 6 months going over it? Or are they that stubborn that they can't admit failure?

Watch the A&E show about cults.

One of the things I found interesting is that they mention in large group settings, the speakers aren’t necessarily there to teach, but rather to perform and demonstrate why they are the leader. It’s a performance that often is long, tedious, and doesn’t actually say much.

That’s how conference feels to me.

It was an aha moment when it clicked.

Just This Guy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 10, 2022 12:54 pm The result of this teaching style is that nothing sinks in.

Maybe that's a tender mercy for the church. If people really thought about what's being shoveled at them they might not stick around more than 40-45 min.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Thu Mar 10, 2022 2:56 pm One of the things I found interesting is that they mention in large group settings, the speakers aren’t necessarily there to teach, but rather to perform and demonstrate why they are the leader. It’s a performance that often is long, tedious, and doesn’t actually say much.

That makes as much sense as anything. It is about establishing the illusion of power than actually edifying.

So the question is do they know they are doing it?

Back in the day when it was still a thing, and now that it will be a thing again, but only after it was announced that it wouldn't be a thing anymore, I watched a few women's general sessions. A few of them were only 90 minutes and even had a few short puppies and playing children videos to break up the monotony.

When the last speaker during one of those 90 minute women's sessions got up I was thinking, "Wow, that went by pretty quick."

Compare that to your average general conference session. Some time during the 1st or 2nd talk after the rest hymn I start getting antsy for the thing to be over. I'm thinking, "Ugh, how much time is left?" Then I check the clock and am utterly crushed to see that there's another 45 minutes to go. From that moment on time. stands. still.

There was a time or two during Monson's term where the PH session was only 90 minutes long. Probably due to his declining health. I was hopeful that it was the beginning of a change to a new format but it was only temporary.

90 minutes is a much better format than two hours. I'd like to see them move to that format, or make general conference have one Saturday night adult session and two Sunday sessions and that be the end of it. That or Old El Paso it and do both the three session and 90 minute session format.

Just This Guy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 10, 2022 12:54 pm Is it intentional to give a excuse to spend the next 6 months going over it?

That's my guess. A lot of work goes into conference. Talks run through legal, correlation, and translation. At the end of conference you've got six months worth of vetted material for members to consume in their local wards. I think laziness is a part of it. You don't have to put in the effort for conference and additional study materials, just work hard on conference, make conference the study material, then rest on that accomplishment for six months.

Now that the two hour block has PH/RS meeting once every other week, you'd think that would create some room to shorten general conference.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Thu Mar 10, 2022 2:56 pm One of the things I found interesting is that they mention in large group settings, the speakers aren’t necessarily there to teach, but rather to perform and demonstrate why they are the leader.

Probably another reason they wont shorten conference. Every apostle has to give a talk during conference, counselors in the FP might give more than one, and if you're Nelson you might give up to four talks. That's nearly 20 talks right there. They'd have to move to a format where an apostle only speaks once a year to shorten conference in any meaningful way.

Under the current church curriculum, conference weekend is largely a waste of time anyway. Why bother watching when you're going to be slowly digesting the most authoritarian and othering talks over the next six months in your local wards?

I never thought that the 3-hour block would be shortened. However, that miracle happened. They could totally see and acknowledge at some point that LESS IS MORE for GC! 1 hour GC. GAs speak once a year, instead of twice. RMN could speak twice instead of 6 times. Dreams do come true!

Enough 2.0 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 6:42 am I never thought that the 3-hour block would be shortened. However, that miracle happened. They could totally see and acknowledge at some point that LESS IS MORE for GC! 1 hour GC. GAs speak once a year, instead of twice. RMN could speak twice instead of 6 times. Dreams do come true!

I just wanted to say hi Enough!

When I was active we never really watched GC - we just took it as a weekend off church and we could read the talks later... it was great and I know DW was doing it for me because she knew I wasn't used to it from growing up and hated that much time listening to talks.

On the flipside, the reactions to GC are so amazing because everyone responds to a different version of GC and takes what they want away from it.

It's amazing to read so much hype in the 1-2 weeks before GC and then when nothing happens see those same people talk about how much they learned even though literally nothing new was announced. On the flip side the people who no longer believe can find all of the problems with the talks (and there are many) and have no regrets for leaving.

But GC is so bad to me because it ends up being two times a year where families double down on church and leave with this sanctimonious glow that then ends up being painful for those who have left or are PIMO... it's really difficult when members are told to double and triple down on the church when there are so many family members struggling to keep up relationships because of the cavern left by the church. And so the talks about empty chairs and time running out make me resent the church because of how every 6 months it can stir up really bad feelings and it's intentionally done IMO.

jfro18 wrote: ↑Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:46 pm When I was active we never really watched GC - we just took it as a weekend off church and we could read the talks later... it was great
...

For many years while still trying to force myself to believe, I referred to any LDS-Inc. meeting with the word "Conference" in the title as "Religious Holiday."

I guess that should have been a sign of the shape of things to come.

Today I heard a talk in sac mtg where the speaker quoted a Q12 quoting Nelson.

The thought occurred to me that I have not heard a truly original sac mtg talk in quite some time, or .. at least original talks are very rare.

Just This Guy wrote: ↑Thu Mar 10, 2022 12:54 pm For example, for general instruction, a person can only really concentrate on a take for 45 minutes reliably. It's recommended that a person then change tasks to something not as mentally involved for 15 minutes before going back to the previous task. After 45-50 minutes their attention drops rapidly. Fur those 15 minutes, it is rendered that some physical movement is helpful to get a person's mind to reset.

Perhaps for seniors, the recommended viewing time can be cut to a half-hour before going to the kitchen for a cup of coffee, then looking for the corresponding session thread started by MoPag on the Support Forum to help decipher the meaning of what you viewed. You can repeat this cycle as desired.

moksha wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 12:24 amPerhaps for seniors, the recommended viewing time can be cut to a half-hour before going to the kitchen for a cup of coffee, then looking for the corresponding session thread started by MoPag on the Support Forum to help decipher the meaning of what you viewed. You can repeat this cycle as desired.

Can I just skip the watching conference and go straight to MoPag's postings? Saves a lot of headache.

Just This Guy wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 8:09 am

moksha wrote: ↑Mon Mar 14, 2022 12:24 amPerhaps for seniors, the recommended viewing time can be cut to a half-hour before going to the kitchen for a cup of coffee, then looking for the corresponding session thread started by MoPag on the Support Forum to help decipher the meaning of what you viewed. You can repeat this cycle as desired.

Can I just skip the watching conference and go straight to MoPag's postings? Saves a lot of headache.

This is exactly what I’ve been doing for the last 5 years!

My family doesn’t seem to understand how I know all the themes and gist of each talk since I wasn’t in the room listening. But hey, yard work gets done that weekend!

Hi, Hagoth!

It doesn't really matter how good or bad conference is. It doesn't matter if it's the same old stuff. To the TTTTTTBM, it's an uplifting, glorious experience. The gushy memes that show up after conference are distasteful to me, but I have to remember that I used to think the same way. I try to watch and play along with the NOM commentary, but I only last one or two talks per conference. I used to eat up every moment, even as a female.

Few years back, on the Sunday before GC in gospel doctrine, the teacher asked who was excited for GC. Most were giddy. She then asked if anyone wasn’t planning on watching it. I rose my hand and said I didn’t really like GC. It seems like a 10 hour funeral to me. The vocal tone, cadence, and general boring topics makes it a very difficult thing to sit through for my mind. My mind does not like GC.