NOM

I saw that post on Reddit asking if there would ever be another Mormon Doctrine or similar type book.

Here’s my idea.

You could do some Tik Tok videos where you read passages from Mormon Doctrine. Then discuss if Mormons still believe it or not.

If you want a deeper written analysis you could go through Mormon Doctrine and make a matrix checklist of items Mormons believed and now don’t.

Or you could take up knitting and crocheting.

That would be kind of fun - this and maybe miracle of forgiveness?

Does anyone have anything in particular that would be good to start with? I don't have a copy but maybe should order it for dramatic effect...

These are the books I wish every member today would see because they were off the reservation at the time but are just completely insane today.

Would you use the first edition of Mo Mo Doctrine or a subsequent edition?

A marvelous work and a wonder is pretty cringeworthy

dogbite wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 8:30 am A marvelous work and a wonder is pretty cringeworthy

I have not looked at Marvelous Work and a Wonder in years. Even as a full believer it was not hard to see that it was not particularly good as a systematic theology. But it was almost required reading as a missionary in the 1980s. I'm not sure it would be similarly recommended today.

jfro18 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:59 pm These are the books I wish every member today would see because they were off the reservation at the time but are just completely insane today.

Being off the reservation at the time would make any comparison to current doctrine easy to dismiss as a strawman. You would have to be careful with framing if you want to avoid that.

Reuben wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 10:51 am

jfro18 wrote: ↑Mon Aug 09, 2021 4:59 pm These are the books I wish every member today would see because they were off the reservation at the time but are just completely insane today.

Being off the reservation at the time would make any comparison to current doctrine easy to dismiss as a strawman. You would have to be careful with framing if you want to avoid that.

That's true - if I were to do videos that way I definitely wouldn't frame it that way... I'd probably just present it as what the church's doctrine was at that point as told by the prophets.

I still wonder how much reach you have on TT beyond the echo chamber... I've seen the pro-church ones (much smaller audience at least currently) and they tend to be very tribalistic and then the exmormon ones (larger selection for sure) which also tend to get the same tribe. That said, the way their algorithm works you'll be seen by a much wider audience and a much younger one.

Oh Miracle of Forgiveness lol. I remember confessing all my sins to my bishop as a young man and being told to go buy the book and read it. Hated how everything fun in life was defined as a mortal sin.
Although I did think it was cool the part about how Cain is still out there roaming the Earth as a big tall hairy vagabond and fugitive. I always wondered how he survived the flood though

jfro18 wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 2:43 pmI still wonder how much reach you have on TT beyond the echo chamber... I've seen the pro-church ones (much smaller audience at least currently) and they tend to be very tribalistic and then the exmormon ones (larger selection for sure) which also tend to get the same tribe. That said, the way their algorithm works you'll be seen by a much wider audience and a much younger one.

Are there analytics that show the views and engagement? Or just likes etc?

John Dehlin has invited a number of Mormon Tic-Tokers onto his YouTube show.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 4:26 pm Are there analytics that show the views and engagement? Or just likes etc?

I assume there are more detailed analytics you can get as a larger account or business, but I can get things like gender, location, and some basic view stuff.

So I'm at 64% female, 36% male and 95% US, 2% canada and 3% other...

From there you can look at specific videos and see "total play time," "average watch time," and % that made it through the video... that could be pretty deflating if everyone dives out early.

But I didn't know to launch analytics until your post so I lot of it still hasn't populated so I will be curious to see what that looks like - I'd love to see the age (that's likely an approximation though I don't think they ask for that info).

ETA: A video I put up yesterday has analytics that are kind of interesting...

87% saw it on their "For You Page" which means it's hitting people that TikTok deems a good fit, which is where you're going to have your content reach people who are likely showing an interest in the church. Just 9% were already me and the rest saw it through my profile.

Average watch time was half the video and 22.7% made it all the way through the 59 second video.

It's pretty cool, but their analytics have nothing on what I can get through Instagram/Facebook when you're running ads.

What % are from Utah?

Specifically the COB?

You should try and get an interview with Dehlin.

Perhaps an episode with all the current Tik Toker’s brainstorming ideas and videos to take down the church!

Get the youth out today and tomorrow when Bednar is Prophet the church will be nothing more than a memory of road show pasts.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Wed Aug 11, 2021 11:02 am What % are from Utah?

Specifically the COB?

You should try and get an interview with Dehlin.

It doesn't give any breakdown by state that I can see, but I can tell you from the website that most are from Utah.

I would LOVE to know the IPs from the COB as I can track that from ldsdiscussions - I know for a fact that it's been accessed by the COB but I can't tell how many times because it has to come up with a specific referral within the church's internal servers.

There definitely might be an interview with Mormon Stories at some point, but I have held off because I don't know how DW would take that and it's not an easy thing to bring up since she believes John Dehlin is the adversary in podcast form.

You should also dress as a missionary and wear a white shirt, tie, and black name tag while doing the videos.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Thu Aug 12, 2021 11:01 am You should also dress as a missionary and wear a white shirt, tie, and black name tag while doing the videos.

I do not have a name tag, but that would make it a lot more fun.

I did some videos early on doing the back and forth between member and a leader (bishop, whatever). Maybe that could be an approach on this stuff as well.

I'm sure there are plenty of people with old missionary tags that could donate them to such a worthy cause. I may see if I can find my old ones. I wonder if they are still buried in my kitchen junk drawer.

Zeezrom wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 2:55 pm Oh Miracle of Forgiveness lol. I remember confessing all my sins to my bishop as a young man and being told to go buy the book and read it. Hated how everything fun in life was defined as a mortal sin.
Although I did think it was cool the part about how Cain is still out there roaming the Earth as a big tall hairy vagabond and fugitive. I always wondered how he survived the flood though

New book title: "Spencer Kimball: the Rise of Modern Mormonism and the Magic World View." Just thinking about his bigfoot story, and the Lamanites getting whiter.

deacon blues wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 10:36 am

Zeezrom wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 2:55 pm Although I did think it was cool the part about how Cain is still out there roaming the Earth as a big tall hairy vagabond and fugitive. I always wondered how he survived the flood though

New book title: "Spencer Kimball: the Rise of Modern Mormonism and the Magic World View." Just thinking about his bigfoot story, and the Lamanites getting whiter.

There is a fairly detailed description of this encounter on the Creative Mormon Mythology thread of the Coffeeshop Forum here at NOM. It happened when Elder Kimball was a young man.

The first page of the thread: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=633

deacon blues wrote: ↑Sat Aug 14, 2021 10:36 am

Zeezrom wrote: ↑Tue Aug 10, 2021 2:55 pm Oh Miracle of Forgiveness lol. I remember confessing all my sins to my bishop as a young man and being told to go buy the book and read it. Hated how everything fun in life was defined as a mortal sin.
Although I did think it was cool the part about how Cain is still out there roaming the Earth as a big tall hairy vagabond and fugitive. I always wondered how he survived the flood though

New book title: "Spencer Kimball: the Rise of Modern Mormonism and the Magic World View." Just thinking about his bigfoot story, and the Lamanites getting whiter.

As a teenager I went to a fireside where the speaker was Maori. He talked about how his skin was getting lighter as he aged. Then he said, "I stand before you as a white Lamanite!"

Back then, I was just bemused. Now I think it's sad.