NOM

I had a dream last night that I was in Berlin Germany and watching people smashing at the Berlin Wall until it eventually fell. Reflecting this morning on this experience....I was not in Berlin when it really happened, but I distinctly remember watching it happen on TV. How emotional it was to see communism fall and the people of East Germany and the Soviet block take their freedom from their oppressors.
It seemed like it all happened so quickly and felt unexpected.
Do you think the fall of Mormonism will happen in a similar way?

With 130 billion in the bank they can survive for a ling time


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1smartdodog wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 9:42 am With 130 billion in the bank they can survive for a ling time.

Agreed.

The church ideology can fade but the organization will perpetuate forever. As long as they continue to build temples, hold no audience conferences, and self report their numbers, the church will never fail.

A Potemkin village of sorts.

1smartdodog wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 9:42 am With 130 billion in the bank they can survive for a ling time

The mathematics of the situation is even crazier. Suppose that the LDS church had 8 billion members as if it was virtually universal. If it still had "only" a measly 130 billion dollars then it would be on verge of utter financial ruin. The budget per capita would be a mere $16 per person which is a disaster. Cash reserves would need to be in the tens of trillions to manage an organization of that size.

The opposite scenario is have 130 billion dollars with a steadily declining population of around 3 million actually active members. The church then has (130 billion / 3 million) $43,000 per member which is enough to to have a large, professional clergy and well-maintained churches and administration offices. This is what we actually see except that they have a small professional clergy.

The LDS church is in the unusual position that it will be ironically, but financially, more stable as membership declines.

I don’t anticipate the membership numbers to decrease rapidly, but the inactive members to increase rapidly. I believe the $130 billion will only be used to preserve the institution and none of it will be used to ease the suffering of members. I’m not sure that have a lot of money can prevent the collapse. Just as the church claimed in the 1950s- 1990s growth was a stone cut out of a mountain rolling and picking up speed, it appears that growth has slowed. We all knows that 75-90% of new convert baptisms become inactive within 5 years, but almost all stay on the membership rolls of the church. It is really the long-time members (boomers) and Gen X that are keeping the activity rates where they were. Just like when Covid hit, attendance dropped, I foresee a time when the boomers are passing away heavily that Gen exers will just stop attending. What will the church do with its billions if nobody is attending? Sure, it will have money to maintain buildings and temples, but if few are attending, then what?

2bizE wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 6:40 pm What will the church do with its billions if nobody is attending? Sure, it will have money to maintain buildings and temples, but if few are attending, then what?

The Oneida community started making silverware. Maybe it just kept making silverware. I don't know the history very well.

I could imagine a time when there will be a super-secret hedge fund with holdings in stocks and real estate worth trillions that just keeps growing in value while employing a core group with lucrative jobs but not doing much else.

When an entity becomes good at making money and their original mission of saving souls seems to fade maybe they'll just become another investment firm like J.P. Morgan or Lehman Bros. giving people advice on where to put their money.

Just think of all those commissions they'll be collecting because Zion Corp is a name you can trust.

"We make the desert bloom"

One thing companies with a large war chest do is to look to grow by acquiring other companies. I had never considered that happening in a religious context but that is what appears to be happening with Scientology and the Nation of Islam. Which is incredibly bizarre considering how Nation of Islam was all about independence from white people, but now they are letting whites teach them Scientology. This strongly suggests a financial motive with N of I needing the financial abilities of Scientology.

So why couldn't LD$ Inc. grow through acquisition? They used to convert whole congregations in the earliest days. What if LD$ Inc could pick up and rescue some religious group on the verge of bankruptcy on the condition of having access to teach the parishioners a Mormonized Christianity. This seems like fantasy but for the fact that Scientology seems to be doing it.

blazerb wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 7:15 pm The Oneida community started making silverware.

The Amana community made refrigerators and radar ranges (microwave ovens). I imagine the Church will work on enlarging their financial empire and perhaps undertake the building of a space ark.

2bizE wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 8:07 am I had a dream last night that I was in Berlin Germany and watching people smashing at the Berlin Wall until it eventually fell. Reflecting this morning on this experience....I was not in Berlin when it really happened, but I distinctly remember watching it happen on TV. How emotional it was to see communism fall and the people of East Germany and the Soviet block take their freedom from their oppressors.
It seemed like it all happened so quickly and felt unexpected.
Do you think the fall of Mormonism will happen in a similar way?

If Jesus Christ came back and said it was false it would collapse.

moksha wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 11:40 pm

blazerb wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 7:15 pm The Oneida community started making silverware.

The Amana community made refrigerators and radar ranges (microwave ovens). I imagine the Church will work on enlarging their financial empire and perhaps undertake the building of a space ark.

If we were actively engaged in building a space ark, I might regain interest in the so called church....

lostinmiddlemormonism wrote: ↑Sun May 09, 2021 4:35 pm

moksha wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 11:40 pm

blazerb wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 7:15 pm The Oneida community started making silverware.

The Amana community made refrigerators and radar ranges (microwave ovens). I imagine the Church will work on enlarging their financial empire and perhaps undertake the building of a space ark.

If we were actively engaged in building a space ark, I might regain interest in the so called church....

Even if the space "ark" is being built to rendezvous with the space "ship" hiding in the tail of the Comet Hale-Bop?

wtfluff wrote: ↑Sun May 09, 2021 5:46 pm

lostinmiddlemormonism wrote: ↑Sun May 09, 2021 4:35 pm

moksha wrote: ↑Sat May 08, 2021 11:40 pm
The Amana community made refrigerators and radar ranges (microwave ovens). I imagine the Church will work on enlarging their financial empire and perhaps undertake the building of a space ark.

If we were actively engaged in building a space ark, I might regain interest in the so called church....

Even if the space "ark" is being built to rendezvous with the space "ship" hiding in the tail of the Comet Hale-Bop?

The question is can it be hijacked to be used as a missile against Ceres?

The church of the latter-day kolobian space ark. It has a good ring to it. Jeebus visited other sheep you know...even on other planets. That is where the other tribes of Isreal are....on other planets that receive their light from Kolob.