Sam and Patty Young's testimonies

[BriansThoughtMirror]

I didn't see this posted. Sam and Patty's testimonies to the disciplinary counsel were amazing. I wish I could know how they affected those who were present. I imagine it was incredibly uncomfortable for them. Could any hearts have been touched? I don't know. I hope some of them at least gave serious thought to what the Youngs were saying.

https://invisiblescubit.wordpress.com/2 ... stimonies/

[IT_Veteran]

I saw this when I got to work this morning and absolutely loved it. I appreciated Sam's testimony and could only imagine the passion he delivered it with.

His wife's testimony blew me away though. What an incredible testimony of Sam and his character!

[Red Ryder]

Patty's words deserve to be repeated here:

Patty’s Testimony (My wife)

I’m really glad I have the opportunity to be here to discuss the situation at hand with Sam. I think my comments about his journey will address both issues that he is being held accountable for in this hearing.

Since we started dating 40 years ago, Sam has always reached out to the lonely, the shy, the widows, the needy, the overlooked, and the outcast.

As the stake single adult representative he would attend the events to make sure these marginalized members felt seen, heard and cared for. At dances he made sure that every girl was danced with and at firesides he made sure every person in attendance got a handshake and personal acknowledgment. Every assignment he has ever received he has always given 150% which is why he has been given many difficult callings such as high council member over stake activities and the older single adult program, stake young men’s president when we took our youth to Salt Lake City, ward mission leader, when he had to go to the mat with the mission president for taking our missionaries away, Easter Cantata chair, and countless others. In each situation he went the extra mile, but his most challenging and rewarding calling from the Lord was as a Bishop in the Maplewood First Ward where there were numerous needs were from a diverse group of members living within the boundaries. At least 30 children in the primary were being raised in single mother homes. These moms felt that the church leadership continued to focus on “ideal families”. These women would come to Sam in tears feeling that they were second class citizens in the church, who were being forgotten. Instead of being praised for making the best of their situation, they were being told they would never be enough. He brought this issue to the attention of local leaders, who shut him down refusing to acknowledge the needs of these women. He then tried to reach the higher authorities who wouldn’t accept his calls or return any communication from a Bishop concerned for his flock. Finally, after several failed attempts to reach anyone in the priesthood, he reached out to the General Relief Society President who expressed her concerns for single parents as well. She was grateful to Sam and told him to continue the good work of reassuring these women of their worth and value, but not to expect a swift change in current attitude. So that’s just what he did, he spent time with them, listened to them, and even hired many of them to work for his business. Maplewood also had several members who were handicapped, confined to wheel chairs and could not use the bathrooms in the church building. This oversight kept these members from attending church. When Sam found out about this situation he immediately went to the person in charge of church buildings in our area to remedy the issue. He was told that Salt Lake refused to make the changes to install a handicapped bathroom at this time, so my husband took matters into his own hands and informed the authorities that he would be hiring a contractor and paying for the remodeling himself. The very next day, the building representative called and said that the changes would be made. To say the least Sam is a man of action

Several years later, he recognized another group of members in the church who were being alienated. People who had questions, doubts, or concerns about the church and no safe place to discuss them. People who were dismissed by their leaders as unrighteous or unfaithful. People who were hurt and confused, who needed fellowship. After seeing the needs of these people, Sam began to have weekly “talkerias” where members could sit and discuss things they felt were not permitted within church walls. He always encouraged ward and stake leaders to attend these events, but none ever accepted his invitation. Sam was concerned that too many good people were leaving the church and was looking to church leaders to help find a solution. Instead they denied that this was a problem.

During this time, Sam joined several online communities of current and former members who posted about uncomfortable or harmful experiences with church leaders. He was very skeptical that these things could be happening in the church, but felt it was worth exploring. After finding out that his own daughters were asked sexually explicit questions in this very stake, he began his campaign to end this practice. First he went to his bishop who denied that these things were occurring and repeatedly insisted there was nothing that could or should be done, so Sam then went to the Stake President, who also decided this matter wasn’t worthy of further discussion or any kind of action. At this point, he was given no other choice but to reach out to the General Authorities, calling upon them to amend the handbook of instructions on how to interview our youth and children. To keep our children and our leaders safe, but as before when he was bishop, his pleas to help the needy fell on deaf ears.

But again, Sam is a man of action. So he took it into his own hands to bring attention to this problem, since conventional methods of reform were not working. He began voting opposed to the policy of interviewing minors alone about sexual matters, not voting opposed to the church leaders themselves, but to the decision to turn a blind eye to this harmful practice occurring in our church. and again our Stake Leaders didn’t try to really understand his no votes. There only concern was that he conform to church traditions of never voicing a concern. He began to promote his cause with the media in hopes to finally reach the ears of the apostles, who so far had refused to listen. His public criticism to make the LDS church a safer place for our youth does not make him an apostate, but rather a disciple of Christ who wants the best for the Lord’s church.

During the last few years that I’ve been going through this process with Sam, I’ve had a chance to sit back and observe. The one thing I’ve noticed is that this church has changed since I joined 48 years ago as a 15 year old girl. All the teachings I’ve learned as a member seem to be lost and forgotten in the “legalistic” rulings from the prophets. We talk less and less about the savior who is kind and loving and does not inquire about our worthiness because he already knows us to be worthy of His love and His atonement. Since they raised the bar over a decade ago, the church has become more oppressive and punitive with little room for joy and happiness. We are always being told to obey our church leaders or we won’t receive blessings. It’s almost become tyrannical versus edifying. The straight and narrow path is a road that allows for freedom and self agency to choose your passage, but the Church has shrunk that path down to a tightrope in which a small misstep leads to shame, embarrassment, and harsh judgment from the leaders.

Neil L. Andersen stated that “fear and faith cannot coexist in our hearts at the same time”, yet I see so much fear in the leaders and members of this church. Leaders are afraid to be criticized, afraid to make change, afraid to leave the safety of their small circle of brothers. The members are afraid to speak up, afraid to ask questions, afraid of being excommunicated. The apostles seem to treat their leadership position more as the executive of a corporation, than as the shepherd who knows each member of his flock by name. What does it really mean to be special witnesses of Jesus Christ

Luke 15:4 says “What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he loses one of them, doth leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?” Sam has continually gone after those lost sheep, he has done so much good to help people who have been harmed by unrighteous dominion, who feel that any opinion other than the leaders is incorrect and sacrilegious. He has sat with them, talked with them, cried with them, prayed with them, and helped with their healing process when the Church wouldn’t.

The Lord asks us to seek revelation. ALL are called upon, not just the Church leaders. All members of the Church, including Sam, should be free to express and bring forth their spiritual promptings without fear of repercussions. Oftentimes, my children have been my best counselors. They would bring something to my attention that may have been critical. This hurt my pride as a parent, but after honest contemplation, I realized they were right. Truth can come from the greatest of us, the smallest of us, and everyone in between. 1st Nephi 16:2-3 is one of our family favorites. Please take time to read it.

Today, Sam is being judged by a handbook, not by his heart, his righteous desires, or his good fruits. But on the final judgment day I am not worried about Sam standing before the Lord . Whatever decision you make today can and will be overruled by our Savior.

If you choose to excommunicate Sam today without having taken anytime to really understand the suffering of these victims nor have personally witnessed the amount of healing that has occurred since Sam has tried to prevent this from happening to others; I don’t see how that judgment would be pleasing to the Lord . There is no denying that Sam is following the will and example of Jesus Christ. The prophet just asked us to call us by our true name—members of the church of Jesus Christ, so that we maintain that emphasis that it is Jesus Christ we follow—not an organization or a handbook. These things are subject to change at anytime. The Lord’s command to mourn with those that mourn, comfort those that stand in need of comfort, and to leave the 90 and 9 to seek after the lost sheep is enduring. It was there long before any handbook and will be there long after this policy is finally updated.

I plead with you today to remember the wise words, “Who am I to judge another, when I walk imperfectly?” As his wife, the one who knows his heart, his intentions, and the fruits of his labors better than anyone in this building, I can tell you with confidence, that this work has been a good one. And it is not the will of the Lord that Sam be stripped of his saving ordinances for seeking to serve the Lord and to follow the example of Jesus Christ.

[Red Ryder]

I'll I can say is that I don't want to belong to any church that kicks out a member like the guy Patty describes.

What a joke.

I also realize our church building doesn't have handicapped bathrooms.

[Reuben]

They're not pulling any punches, are they?

Sam: Protect the leaders, or protect the children.

Patty: You don't deserve this disciple of Jesus.

[Thoughtful]

They're not pulling any punches, are they?

Sam: Protect the leaders, or protect the children.

Patty: You don't deserve this disciple of Jesus.

It was brilliant.

[Mormorrisey]

I have to admit, I loved Patty's words more than Sam's, believe it or not. The things she said were pretty poignant. What a PR nightmare for the church.

[Culper Jr.]

Wow, her testimony was amazing. The church doesn't deserve him; or her. This really shows the church leaders for what they are in the clearest of terms. Sam is acting as the minister and example of Christ that they should be; that they claim to be. They are hypocrites and pharisees, and their actions toward Sam could not illustrate this more clearly.

[Raylan Givens]

I was very moved by this.

My thoughts:
Get rid of yearly worthiness interviews (they are cloaked as something else, but really it is a gatekeeper meeting).

Have an open door policy, establish a model where youth go to the Bishop for support or help. Much like how other clergy view meeting with their flock.

It isn't about being a gatekeeper, but about having another loving and caring adult on their side. My BP for the most part were great, but I always dreaded the call from the executive secretary when my birthday came around....

[blazerb]

I was very moved by this.

My thoughts:
Get rid of yearly worthiness interviews (they are cloaked as something else, but really it is a gatekeeper meeting).

Have an open door policy, establish a model where youth go to the Bishop for support or help. Much like how other clergy view meeting with their flock.

It isn't about being a gatekeeper, but about having another loving and caring adult on their side. My BP for the most part were great, but I always dreaded the call from the executive secretary when my birthday came around....

I agree as long as the visits with the bishop occur in view of others like a scoutmaster conference. I don't think kids should be encouraged to visit with any adult in a room alone.

I think the idea of repentance is totally messed up in the church. I was impacted by a very good institute teach I had. He asked us how long it took Alma the Younger to repent. We all said three days. He corrected us. Alma spent three days racked with guilt. His repentance took an instant, though. His guilt was cleared immediately. We don't pay attention to our scriptures. We insist that repentance requires confession, pain, public penance. That's crap.

Any god I could believe in would just require our best efforts. Repentance is a change, not agony. The GA's pay lip service to this, but then put in place practices that inflict damage if you've committed one of the "serious" sins. That list of serious sins includes things that need to be rethought rather than concentrating on things that do damage to others and society.

[Arcturus]

End of Sam's testimony:

"May this day be the day you chose to protect the little ones rather than protecting an institution.

This evening, I’ve delivered a witness to you. I am not alone. My sails are billowing with the teachings and example of Jesus Christ. He is my dear and powerful ally.

May he be yours, too.

Amen"

The sexual abuse examples he shared with the HC are horrifying. And Patty's testimony is amazing.

[MoPag]

Wow! Just when I thought I couldn't love Sam and Patty anymore than I already do!! They are truly amazing people!

I really love this part:

Today, Sam is being judged by a handbook, not by his heart, his righteous desires, or his good fruits. But on the final judgment day I am not worried about Sam standing before the Lord . Whatever decision you make today can and will be overruled by our Savior.

This whole thing is just so maddening though. It's like the only "sin" the church cares about is when someone triggers the church leaders' own insecurities.

[StarbucksMom]

Wow, how can ziontology escape this newest PR nightmare? I bet Newsroom is hiring, probably doubling their workforce.

So I am kind of confused about this and the whole non disclosure thing. I just read these posts, are these the statements they wrote out, so they can release them? Did Sam just not sign the agreement??

[IT_Veteran]

Wow, how can ziontology escape this newest PR nightmare? I bet Newsroom is hiring, probably doubling their workforce.

So I am kind of confused about this and the whole non disclosure thing. I just read these posts, are these the statements they wrote out, so they can release them? Did Sam just not sign the agreement??

Sam signed it, so did Patty. He didn't record, but had prepared his written remarks in advance, so he just released those.

[StarbucksMom]

Thank you ITVet!

[Hagoth]

Wow, how can ziontology escape this newest PR nightmare? I bet Newsroom is hiring, probably doubling their workforce.

So I am kind of confused about this and the whole non disclosure thing. I just read these posts, are these the statements they wrote out, so they can release them? Did Sam just not sign the agreement??

Sam signed it, so did Patty. He didn't record, but had prepared his written remarks in advance, so he just released those.

Right. They don't care what Sam and patty said, they only care that people will hear what the leaders said, or how they reacted. Can't have that.

[Not Buying It]

Unfortunately, however elegant and eloquent the defense, the outcome is pre-determined. The Church has a thorn in its side it wants removed.

[GoodBoy]

I really love this part:

Today, Sam is being judged by a handbook, not by his heart, his righteous desires, or his good fruits. But on the final judgment day I am not worried about Sam standing before the Lord . Whatever decision you make today can and will be overruled by our Savior.

I loved that too.

I honestly feel bad for his poor Stake President. He has a very difficult no-win decision to make. I hope he follows his conscience instead of the handbook.

I hope that is why this is taking so long for them to get back to him. I hope that it is his Stake President saying, "No. I'm not going to excommunicate this good man. If you want it done, do it yourself."

I think that it is pretty clear in the scriptures that the First Presidency has to be the ones to "try" bishops anyway:

D&C 68:22-23
22 And again, no bishop or high priest who shall be set apart for this ministry shall be tried or condemned for any crime, save it be before the First Presidency of the church;
23 And inasmuch as he is found guilty before this Presidency, by testimony that cannot be impeached, he shall be condemned;

[Red Ryder]

I really love this part:

Today, Sam is being judged by a handbook, not by his heart, his righteous desires, or his good fruits. But on the final judgment day I am not worried about Sam standing before the Lord . Whatever decision you make today can and will be overruled by our Savior.

I loved that too.

I honestly feel bad for his poor Stake President. He has a very difficult no-win decision to make. I hope he follows his conscience instead of the handbook.

Isn't the handbook his conscience?