NOM

Just to tell you how TBM my wife is I went ahead and wrote out all my issues with the church for her to look at in her leisure time. I only had 33 !!!! I wrote them because we can never discuss them she just won't do it well turns out she would not look at the list , big surprise (not). I was having faith that someday she would come around but nope she chooses to stick her head in the sand . I find it difficult to understand how some people especially those we Love will not even look at a list . I will hope and pray as always that the Lord will show her the way someday !!! Thanks for listening.

It's hard, it really is. I honestly think there are a number of people out there that if you asked them "If the church is not true, would you want to know?" that would answer in the negative. My FIL, rather than actually addressing the issues that Kalikala is struggling with, bore his testimony to her and encouraged her to have faith. I can tell by reading his letter he really cares about her and wants her to be happy, but he really sees no other way than staying in the church. He'd rather be wrong about the church and stay in it than anything else because it's where he derives hope from.

I understand what you are going through and you have my full sympathy and compassion.

You can only do what you can do.

I am about 9 years into this journey and my wife has yet to read any of my issues. I actually wrote a 170 page power point presentation and offered it to her so she could know where I was coming from. She hasn't taken me up on that offer yet.

But 9 years in we are closer than ever.

Just breath. Go slow. And work on the parts of your marriage that you do share in common. And let her set the pace without trying to force it.

Good luck.

Look, your TBM wife doesn't get to have an identity that is independent of your testimony. All of her life she has been told that she will be worthless unless she is married to a righteous priesthood holder in the temple. The only way her life will matter is if she is part of a celestial family. If she is TBM she believes this. Your faith crisis is about so much more for her than your evolving beliefs. Her actions are motivated by fear more than a disregard for your feelings. So just keeping being kind. Love her more than you dislike the church.

Here's a counterintuitive idea you might consider.

There's an old saying that suggests the person that cares the least in the relationship holds all the power. This is true with our relationships with the church and by extension the church threesomes we find ourselves in with spouses, children, parents & in-laws, and even ward leaders.

Consider disengaging from all church conversations with her and maintain an apathetic frame. Wait until she brings them up then respond with "the church really doesn't work for me, would you like to know all the reasons why?" When she declines, calmly respond with "ok, let me know if you change your mind". Stay calm and maintain an apathetic frame. This response will elicit one of two responses. First, it will either funnel her into listening to (or reading about) your issues which leads to more open communication. Or second, it will expose the true gap and lack of trust in your relationship which only you will be able to assess and determine if you can continue to live with.

At some point she will recognize that you aren't going to be manipulated by the church narrative, her demands, or the emotional manipulation evoked during fights between you both about the church.

Once you establish your "rules of engagement" sit back and do what HIPS suggested above:

HIPS wrote:Just breath. Go slow. And work on the parts of your marriage that you do share in common. And let her set the pace without trying to force it.

Indifference will kill the church.

MoPag wrote: ↑Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:24 am Look, your TBM wife doesn't get to have an identity that is independent of your testimony. All of her life she has been told that she will be worthless unless she is married to a righteous priesthood holder in the temple. The only way her life will matter is if she is part of a celestial family. If she is TBM she believes this. Your faith crisis is about so much more for her than your evolving beliefs. Her actions are motivated by fear more than a disregard for your feelings. So just keeping being kind. Love her more than you dislike the church.

+1

Great point Mopag!

I have a growing list of study topics that interest me that no one around me really wants to hear about. It's not just science fiction trivia because that's actually a subject that my family will happily talk about. Few want to hear about real history or serious philosophy. Virtually no one wants to discuss LDS history or philosophy unless it's directly from the correlated lesson manual.

I was told that intellectual integrity is it's own reward. It's a gift you give to yourself. The deep irony comes when you see others around you that are holding a shoddy, knock-off version of intellectual integrity. They defend this tiny, Mormon tchotchke and I am increasingly reluctant to help believers see anything new.

Corsair wrote: ↑Mon Jun 25, 2018 10:54 am Virtually no one wants to discuss LDS history or philosophy unless it's directly from the correlated lesson manual.

I was told that intellectual integrity is it's own reward. It's a gift you give to yourself. The deep irony comes when you see others around you that are holding a shoddy, knock-off version of intellectual integrity.

That's the saddest part I think. It reflects what I was trying to get across in my post about my FIL's response to DW's questions about polygamy. He repeated the correlated history and doctrine, said there may be mistakes in it, but to just continue in faith and not read things that cause you to question or doubt.

I made the mistake of just spewing everything out at once when I discovered all of the issues I never previously knew about... and over the course of the last 3+ months of that my wife *still* has not been willing to research anything. She will listen to me, but never gives a second thought to anything I say.

It's a really weird feeling. She tells me that she wants to know if it's true, but the moment that I give any in-depth detail to these issues, she tells me it doesn't matter anyway.

The point is that I think everyone is different and everyone is also on their own timetable. I'm not sure if there's anything you or I can do to get them to do that research, but hopefully over time they'll trust us enough to do it. If not, we just have to live our lives the best we can and be the best spouse/parents we can and go from there. I'm trying to remember that sometimes... it's really difficult especially when you come across a new piece of history you didn't know or the church says/does something that is angering.

Hopefully you have luck over time - I hope we all do. Until then, this is a good outlet for trying to get some steam out especially when there are very few outside options of people to talk to that have any idea what this kind of stuff does to people.