NOM

Am I the only heretical Mormon who gets the "pity" look from fellow saints at church? Perhaps I am hyper sensitive, but it seems people give a sad faced look when they shake my hand in church now. To give a little context, I have been pretty open with critical commentary in the past and no longer keep up typical virtue-signaling duties and behaviors of the mainstream members.

Is this really a thing or is it merely my own cognition?

I don't know. I never got pity looks when people shook my hand. I had people avoiding speaking to me. But then rather than an open heretic, I was much worse. I was an open feminist. It was my spouseman who got pity looks.

alas wrote: ↑Sun Mar 11, 2018 2:33 pm I never got pity looks when people shook my hand. I had people avoiding speaking to me. But then rather than an open heretic, I was much worse. I was an open feminist.

Same^^^
When I do interact with people at church who have me pegged as a pathetic sinner, I try to be extra happy and nice. It flies in the face of their narrative. They expect passive aggressiveness from me, or they expect me to be miserable because I'm a sinner. But if I'm happy and kind they usually don't know what to do.

Has anyone here ever beaten them to it and pulled the pity look first?

FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Sun Mar 11, 2018 1:42 pm Am I the only heretical Mormon who gets the "pity" look from fellow saints at church? Perhaps I am hyper sensitive, but it seems people give a sad faced look when they shake my hand in church now. To give a little context, I have been pretty open with critical commentary in the past and no longer keep up typical virtue-signaling duties and behaviors of the mainstream members.

Is this really a thing or is it merely my own cognition?

I've gotten the "pity look", but mostly now they ignore me. During a funeral I had last year, the stake-president and his first came past me, and I felt like they were showing up in force as they passed. I was cordial with them, and they with me. In the past I have had great anger toward these men, but what made me laugh was as they came through the room and passed me, all I could do was feel a sense of pity for them. The thought crossed my mind that they were not only unable to answer my questions, they were unable to even UNDERSTAND my questions in the first place. Its like trying to explain calculus to a first-grader.

So, somewhere in there, the pity look has shifted: it ain't them giving it to me as much as me giving it to them.

It was kindof a surreal moment. And I mean it just like that...it was a "aha moment" for me.

Give them a throat punch..... something to feel sad about.

We can never forget how deep the training is to "know" less actives or heretics, are by virtue of their wickedness, unhappy and in the depths of despair.

As long as they know this, they are content to keep up with the others going as hard as they can in the maze.

I think the best thing is to be as cheerful as you an muster on any given day. It really messes with their world view.

We let our kids go or not go to events if they want to. We don't make them go. That's enough to get my kids labelled inactive, verbally not officially. Orthodox mo's don't understand "free to choose". Go figure.

I am SOOOOOOOOOOOOO guilty of this when I was TBM.

And now that I am the leper, I try to follow this as much as I can:

No Tof wrote: ↑Mon Mar 12, 2018 9:57 am I think the best thing is to be as cheerful as you an muster on any given day. It really messes with their world view.

I'm guessing your DW get's more pity looks and gestures than you do directly. You know most of them are looking at you like you are lost and broken, or at least they are thinking it.

Here's a twist on this topic: At work, I'm the one dishing out the pity when a poor TBM friend expresses their exhaustion over all the church work and meetings they had to do on Sunday. There's an exchange of "How was your weekend?" I usually sleep in a bit Saturday, getup and make DW breakfast, along with my signature Latte. I then get all my crap done around the house on Saturday. Sunday I'm off to enjoy outdoor time up in the mountains or out by the lake. I usually have lots of new pictures to prove it. My poor TBM friend didn't even get out of the church building until after the sun was down. Also, he just invested in a new set of kick butt digital camera gear, same as mine. My heart aches for him, he has my empathy and pity.

I haven't seen them yet. I spent the last year working as many Sundays as I could, or not feeling well, so everybody just seemed to accept that I worked a lot. DW went to church two weeks ago, three days after I emailed my bishop to let him know I wasn't coming back. She had a good conversation with him, but we've been out of town since, so don't know yet who we're going to get the pity looks from. I won't be there, but I'm sure I'll get some questions from people as I see them around town.

It's been my experience that the "pity look" is often a cover for the "confused and worried look" because they don't want to accidentally show the "unintentionally interested and mildly envious look". Believers dealing with a former believer have to deal with an often unspoken subtext. The orthodox believer has a list of religious concerns that the former believer simply doesn't need to worry about.

I had a surprisingly good discussion with one of my sisters recently who opened with the pity look out of basic concern for my eternal soul. I responded with an earnest discussion of what I have been studying in early Christian history. I was able to say some good things about belief in Jesus Christ and an appreciation for core Christian teachings. My sister had opened with the pity look then proceeded through confused and ended up with unintentionally interested. This may be my preferred method going forward rather than proceed into the headlines of the CES Letter and Mormon Think.

Corsair wrote: ↑Wed Mar 14, 2018 9:25 am I had a surprisingly good discussion with one of my sisters recently who opened with the pity look out of basic concern for my eternal soul. I responded with an earnest discussion of what I have been studying in early Christian history. I was able to say some good things about belief in Jesus Christ and an appreciation for core Christian teachings. My sister had opened with the pity look then proceeded through confused and ended up with unintentionally interested. This may be my preferred method going forward rather than proceed into the headlines of the CES Letter and Mormon Think.

When are you going to start the Chips and Salsa with Corsair podcast? I'm already a fan!

I didn't have a white shirt for church a couple weeks ago so I wore a striped shirt and felt very out of place, I thought everyone was giving me looks whether they were or not. I think there's probably some real pity looks, but being NOM/progressive/ex-in-spirit can be such a high anxiety situation I think I make some of the pity looks up in my head.

Just give them a big smile and a handshake at Church when you greet fellow members. No need to second guess what they are thinking. Save your energy for making it through the service and classes. Treat yourself to an ice-cold Diet Coke or some other beverage when you get home.

Maybe it's not a look of pity, but the fear of catching the heretical leprosy.

In which case a smile and a handshake like the tuxedo'd one suggested will do them a whole lotta good.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Wed Mar 14, 2018 10:23 am When are you going to start the Chips and Salsa with Corsair podcast? I'm already a fan!

Are you a fan of chips and salsa? Or just amusing things from Christian history?

With that in mind, if/when you get your next look of "pity" from your condescending family or friends, ask them when they think the Great Apostasy occurred. Joseph Smith's Restoration is both irrelevant and untrue if there was no Great Apostasy. Meanwhile, Peter, James, and John were succeeded by Clement, Ignatius, and Polycarp as bishops in Rome and Smyrna. We know about them based on their writings that almost became part of the New Testament. They ordained men like Irenaus of Lyon who served a congregation in the second century that endured persecution that makes the Mormon Pioneers look like amateurs.

I have brought this up with two different believing relatives and they both could not help but ask, "I wonder if they held the Melchizedek Priesthood?" I simply responded, "How would you detect that they did or did not?" The look of pity will turn to an existential worry that their fundamental belief might be wrong. It won't last, unfortunately. But they will change the subject rather than wade further into dangerous waters.