NOM

Just wondering your thoughts on this question.
I’m is not specifically defined in section 89.
Is someone who drinks coffee evil?

I drink coffee and I'm pretty evil.

COFFEE IS EVIL!!!!!!!!!


but thank goodness for power drinks....

I think coffee is pretty much just, meh.

It's injurious!
Hearken unto wisdom and be ye saved:

Now it came to pass that the sons of men found in the land a certain plant having broad leaves and an acrid taste and it stupified the people. 2. And some burned it and drew the smoke thereof into their mouths & some put it in their mouths and spit forth the juice thereof for it was much & many made it very fine and drew it into their noses. . . . [H]earken unto wisdom & be ye saved. 6. Strong drink is ruin; much wine is an evil, tea is a curse, coffee is injurious, tobaccoes disgustful and poisonous and altogether are a great damnation. 6. [repeated number] Drink water alone, live on simple diet take due exercise and ye shall be happy.35

Coffee enemas are evil!

Coffee and tea are some of the healthiest foods you could find, which makes it pretty funny that they're excluded by a "health" code. Not many members understand that some early church leaders included soup and hot chocolate as banned substances as well because "hot drinks" meant exactly that. The whole thing was based on outdated medical concepts that putting hot liquids in your body somehow put your humors out of balance and made you susceptible to disease. If only God could have known at the time that there were tiny evil spirits called germs that could be killed by boiling water. He should have kept a closer eye on what that Pasteur guy was up to.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:26 pm Coffee enemas are evil!

You are clearly doing it wrong. Please drink your coffee with your mouth in a civilized manner. I like mine black and unsweetened, just like my soul apparently.

The ban on coffee from the Word of Wisdom has a sketchy past. As far as I can tell, it's status came from the pseudo-scientific idea of D&C 89:9

Joseph Smith wrote:9 And again, hot drinks are not for the body or belly.

That's all it says. Apparently it was a common rumor in the early 1800s that disease came from drinking things warmer than room temperature. It was kind of nebulous until Heber J. Grant made it a requirement to get a temple recommend and forbid coffee. Tea was apparently added so that women would also have something to sacrifice. So coffee has no real basis in evil and I defy you to find a doctrinal basis today other than "Follow the Prophet". The prophet can still drink his Diet Coke, of course.

Corsair wrote:The prophet can still drink his Diet Coke, of course.

Thanks to the Proclamation on the soda!

2bizE wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:24 pm Just wondering your thoughts on this question.
I’m is not specifically defined in section 89.
Is someone who drinks coffee evil?

Going by the number of believing spouses who can handle an exmo spouse not attending church but totally flip out over the spouse drinking coffee, I'd have to say it's obviously the devil's brew.

Not drinking coffee is an in-group marker, nothing more. And going by the science, specifically how caffeine and antioxidants reduce chronic inflammation, one of the worst things the church ever did to my mother, who has rheumatoid arthritis like I do, was keep her from drinking coffee. I'm not making the same mistake of confusing fitting in with being a good person.

FWIW, chronic inflammation increases as we age. Caffeine and antioxidants counteracting it is the going theory for why people who drink coffee tend to live longer.

2bizE wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:24 pmIs someone who drinks coffee evil?

As always: It depends.

You probably need to define "evil" before we can decide if that wonderful, healthy, tasty, dark beverage can turn make a person "evil".

Well, my ward considers me evil, and I drink a fair amount of coffee. Therefore...

In reality, coffee is just an object. Even if you believe in good and evil, a drink is not the blood of Satan. it is inherently neither good no evil, it just exists. It is the intents of the person wielding it that will make it one way or the other.

A gun can be used to feed and protect a family or it can be used to murder someone. It purely depends on what is driving the hands that are holding it.

I’m perplexed by the concept of evil. (Perhaps a topic for another thread)

Coffee was a big deal for me to come to terms with. For the first half of my life I even hated the smell of coffee, believing it to be bad in every way. Cause the prophet told us so.

A couple of years after my shelf crashed I started to wonder why most people in the world liked that dark bitter brew abd did some research. Turns out like others have said, science is pro coffee in moderation.

First taste test went pretty bad. Cheap coffee, by myself (probably looking to see who saw me drinking it) with sugar and weird edible oil whitener 🤮.

Found lattes, mochas, flat whites and macchiatos. Sigh. I was in love.

So is it evil? I think not!

Hagoth wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:28 pm Coffee and tea are some of the healthiest foods you could find, which makes it pretty funny that they're excluded by a "health" code. Not many members understand that some early church leaders included soup and hot chocolate as banned substances as well because "hot drinks" meant exactly that. The whole thing was based on outdated medical concepts that putting hot liquids in your body somehow put your humors out of balance and made you susceptible to disease. If only God could have known at the time that there were tiny evil spirits called germs that could be killed by boiling water. He should have kept a closer eye on what that Pasteur guy was up to.

The bounds of God’s wisdom and foresight are Joseph Smith’s lifetime, so understandably he couldn’t see what Pasteur was doing after Joseph Smith died. This is also why Book of Mormon prophets could see Columbus and the American Revolution, but everything occurring post 1820s was inscrutable to them. Also explains why a “book for our day” is limited to social perceptions, norms, theories, and philosophies of the early 1800s, but largely incompetent to address any compelling questions arising in the Age of the Internet. Don’t blame God, it’s the way the universe is set up.

Flaming Meaux wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2018 9:20 pm

Hagoth wrote: ↑Thu Feb 22, 2018 5:28 pm Coffee and tea are some of the healthiest foods you could find, which makes it pretty funny that they're excluded by a "health" code. Not many members understand that some early church leaders included soup and hot chocolate as banned substances as well because "hot drinks" meant exactly that. The whole thing was based on outdated medical concepts that putting hot liquids in your body somehow put your humors out of balance and made you susceptible to disease. If only God could have known at the time that there were tiny evil spirits called germs that could be killed by boiling water. He should have kept a closer eye on what that Pasteur guy was up to.

The bounds of God’s wisdom and foresight are Joseph Smith’s lifetime, so understandably he couldn’t see what Pasteur was doing after Joseph Smith died. This is also why Book of Mormon prophets could see Columbus and the American Revolution, but everything occurring post 1820s was inscrutable to them. Also explains why a “book for our day” is limited to social perceptions, norms, theories, and philosophies of the early 1800s, but largely incompetent to address any compelling questions arising in the Age of the Internet. Don’t blame God, it’s the way the universe is set up.

I’ll add that, consistent with prevailing theories on diet in the 1800s, members would’ve been encouraged to avoid spicy foods as well—apparently such foods heighten the carnal passions.

Coffee is neither good nor bad, but thinking makes it so.

There are definitely evil coffees out there! Bitter and unpleasant, but it's certainly in the mouth of the beholder.

No Tof wrote: ↑Mon Dec 25, 2017 10:40 pm I had to overcome the idea that coffee was somehow connected to the devil.

It is basically an unfounded rumor that coffee was in league with the devil. In reality, this stigma arose due to the coffee and tea plants growing in the demilitarized zone during the Heaven War. Because of this, they were thought to be neutral and their valiancy was questioned.

It should be noted that coffee and tea were not the only plants that grew in this demilitarized zone during the Heaven War. The same accusations of non-valiancy would arise if hot drinks were made with kale, quinoa, and rhubarb.

In truth, the only plants known to give direct aid to God's second son, Lucifer, were the licorice and anise plants. It really made no sense to punish these plants since they knew not what they did, however, they too would be shunned if made into hot drinks. The taste of both the licorice plant and star anise seeds should serve as a cautionary reminder about bringing them in contact with hot water for a flavor-infusing experience.

Hope that helps.

RubinHighlander wrote: ↑Fri Feb 23, 2018 8:38 amThere are definitely evil coffees out there! Bitter and unpleasant, but it's certainly in the mouth of the beholder.

Good point. Some convenience-store coffee is definitely evil...

No but it tastes like an evil hideous drink.

And the earth brought forth grass, and herb yielding seed after his kind, and the tree yielding fruit, whose seed was in itself, after his kind: and God saw that it was good.