NOM

So its freaking cold up here so I thought I'd make another post.

Yesterday in church the bishop came up to me to say hi. (in my new spirit of playing nice, I even called him bishop)

He once again said how he needed to come visit me. He's been saying this for the past two years, almost as long as he's been bishop..... anyways, as he was making excuses for not making contact because we weren't home the times he came, I couldn't help myself remind him of the new invention called the phone. (oops..... )

This morning I woke up with the thought that I would call to invite him and his wife to come over for dinner and a visit. That way he could check off the box of visiting "never there Brother Not Of" and I can let him see I'm harmless. I remember when I was a bishop and was scared to visit the less active.

Any advice before I make the call?

I'm a really introverted introvert, so I don't know if inviting people over is something I'd do on a regular basis, but if you and the missus enjoy hosting get-togethers, that's not a bad idea. I think the largest shelf-shaker is to see "apostates" who are normal, enjoy life, and don't seem to miss the rigamarole of churchiness. And you know what? If you can make a bishop's life enjoyable for one night, great shall be your reward. Go for it!

Ok. So I chickened out.

I realize this hasn't been that interesting a topic but in the hopes that it will be helpful to someone I'll continue with the saga.

I finally girded up my loins and invited the Bishop and his wife for dinner last week. They graciously declined due to conflicts in their schedule. Apparently son's basketball is more important than visiting lost sheep. Im cool with that.

Went to the ward yesterday for SM and despite sitting way in the back, the ES asked me to come to the BP office for a chat. I let him know that the cultural hall is actually a much better place to visit. He returned and reported. Next thing you know the bishop is at my side saying hi and again invites me to his office. (for a couple of years now I have been warning you all not to enter said office due to the pressure and sense of authority it elicits ) He must have caught me at a weak moment because I agreed.

In the office, you could tell the poor guy was nervous. He called me Bishop Not Of

Bishop: Just want to know where you are.
BP Not Of: Im right here with you.
Bishop: You know what I mean.
BP NOTOF: I do but I imagine what you are searching for is a longer conversation then you think, and we are just not good enough friends for that kind of discussion.

I could see he was starting to sweat so I invited him to relax and that I actually did understand his dilemma.

We then had a friendly visit about what it means to establish and honour boundaries, the need for civil discussion over the need to establish right and wrong, and the assurance that I was fine and happier then I've ever felt in my life.

We will see if anything comes of this or if he can now check my box off as complete.

so you getting a calling any time soon, or was that part of boundary setting?

I really like the approach you used in the conversation with your bishop. Even though you were in his office, you took control of the discussion. Good for you.

I'll echo azflyer and say I really like your approach with the Bishop. I may steal it if I have the courage. Sometime (probably this year) I will be offered a new calling and I will almost certainly need to decline it which I fear will inevitably lead to follow up questions. However, I'm not close with any of the bishopric. They all seem like decent dudes but they're essentially strangers. I'd love to be able to say that we don't have the kind of relationship that would naturally lead to me talking about my feelings on the church. More likely I'll panic and say things that I'll regret. My worst nightmare of all is that in my panic I accept the calling to appease my wife and keep up appearances.

TestimonyLost wrote:I'll echo azflyer and say I really like your approach with the Bishop. I may steal it if I have the courage. Sometime (probably this year) I will be offered a new calling and I will almost certainly need to decline it which I fear will inevitably lead to follow up questions. However, I'm not close with any of the bishopric. They all seem like decent dudes but they're essentially strangers. I'd love to be able to say that we don't have the kind of relationship that would naturally lead to me talking about my feelings on the church. More likely I'll panic and say things that I'll regret. My worst nightmare of all is that in my panic I accept the calling to appease my wife and keep up appearances.

Strength and honor! No fate but what we make.

Once you taste the power of self determination, it gets addicting. Then they leave you the hell alone.

TestimonyLost wrote: ↑Tue Mar 13, 2018 9:15 am I'll echo azflyer and say I really like your approach with the Bishop. I may steal it if I have the courage. Sometime (probably this year) I will be offered a new calling and I will almost certainly need to decline it which I fear will inevitably lead to follow up questions. However, I'm not close with any of the bishopric. They all seem like decent dudes but they're essentially strangers. I'd love to be able to say that we don't have the kind of relationship that would naturally lead to me talking about my feelings on the church. More likely I'll panic and say things that I'll regret. My worst nightmare of all is that in my panic I accept the calling to appease my wife and keep up appearances.

I think my favorite thing about the digital age is the ability to do things like this over email. No close relationships necessary. I sent my bishop an email to let him know where I stand (I'm not coming back to the church) and that I don't want contact from the bishopric or priesthood leaders, home teachers, etc. My DW met with him a few days later. He talked to her to make sure he understands my desires, made sure I wasn't offended by anyone (or him), and asked what types of events I would be willing to attend (I told him in the email I still considered members of the ward friends, so long as they didn't try to make me a project).

He was very respectful and has so far respected my requests. Doing this in an email allowed me to put it all out there and not be guilted into softening my stance. It worked well for me and I highly recommend it. Under the guidance of others on this forum (and some various FB support groups) I did not include any specific concerns, questions, or issues I have with the church. It was just really where my membership stands and how I plan to support my family in their own membership.

No Tof wrote: ↑Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:32 amBP NOTOF: I do but I imagine what you are searching for is a longer conversation then you think, and we are just not good enough friends for that kind of discussion.

I love the sentence above! The "we're not really good enough friends" statement might be a bit harsh, but definitely honest and truthful. Sounds like he took it OK. Honestly, he probably really doesn't want to have that conversation, but feels it is his duty.


This snippet is awesome too:

No Tof wrote: ↑Mon Mar 12, 2018 11:32 amWe then had a friendly visit about what it means to establish and honour boundaries, the need for civil discussion over the need to establish right and wrong...

I don't see myself having any of these sorts of conversations in the near future, but you never know eh? I hope if I do I can overcome my complete failure as a social being, and remember some of these tactics to steer the conversation, and keep it civil. I really NOT good at doing that when I'm challenged, so it will be a fun social experiment if it ever happens.