NOM

Here's a link to the story in the Salt Lake Tribune:

http://www.sltrib.com/news/5472859-155/ ... ast-minute

Supporter Beverly Christensen Soutas said the action was "disheartening."

"It's one more time these kids are rejected and marginalized," she said. "They are claiming Encircle is an advocacy group. Of course, the Provo Freedom Festival is not going to come out and say, we won't let you in because you support gay youth."

One of the many ways that Happy Valley lets gays and lesbians know they aren't welcome...

The absence from NOM may be simply that we all simply assumed that a Utah based parade would reflect LDS cultural customs. It will take radicial change in virtue signalling from the apostles before we start expecting otherwise.

Still, it's a good, annual test of LDS culture if Encircle, a Provo based LGBTQ resource center, is allowed into America's Freedom Festival Parade. This is not, after all, the Pioneed Day celebration which is distinctly LDS. It's also not the Utah Freedom Festival. It's supposed to be America's Freedom Festival celebrating a freedom which implies that certain groups are going to have radically different ideas but still have to get along with basic civility. Encircle is not a more radical advocacy group like Bash Back!, Radical Faeries, Gay Liberation Front, or Queer Nation. They just want to prevent youth suicides, particularly LGBT ones.

I truly wonder how America's Freedome Festival would react if some individual wanted to march and simply hold a banner with the URL to https://mormonandgay.lds.org/.

This is so sad! Those poor kids. Why is it always the kids they attack? The POX policy, Savannah and now this resource center for LGBTQ kids? These are children, people! Ugh!!! How f@#$ed up and insecure does someone have to be to target children.

If I was in charge of the parade I would probably turn them away just out of concern for their own safety.

Can you imagine a float of LGBT youth parading down the street in Provo? They would either get booed, silenced, or shot by bullets made of jello.

This was a really dumb move by the parade organizers. Like Corsair alluded to earlier, the LDS church's official stance shown on https://mormonandgay.lds.org/ is far more accepting of LGBT+ individuals than this move to exclude an organization like Encircle.

This parade stuff has been a little more personal for me than it would have been because I spent the weekend with my family in the mountains and my parents and gay nephew had to leave Monday night so they could be in the parade. My parents are missionaries in the area and got to ride in the double-decker buss. My nephew is in a local marching band. There was a post on reddit of the missionaries at the parade with my parents bus in the background about how the church is more of an advocacy group than Encircle. I support LGBT+ rights and think the parade organizers are stupid, but my parents are in the bus with the organizers. Sigh.

On the bright side, this is probably the best outcome for Encircle as an organization, they are getting a ton of free publicity. Hopefully it helps more than it hurt.

Linked wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:22 pm On the bright side, this is probably the best outcome for Encircle as an organization, they are getting a ton of free publicity. Hopefully, it helps more than it hurt.

Right - Their Fbook page is soaring while Freedom Festival page is flailing. This is Encircle's chance to for some free prime time PR messages if they play their cards rights.

I still don't understand why the Non-orthodox Mormons (exmo's, etc) get all worked up by this with outrage of "why did they do that". The outrage in the form advocating on their behalf is great, but getting pissed for the sake of getting pissed is an exercize in futility. What do they think will happen in Provo? Being gay might be a Salt Lake problem, but it's tentacles haven't reach Happy Valley yet. That's why people move to Happy Valley. /s

I gave the freedom festival a bad review on Google Maps. We should reach out to the sponsors and entertainers and voice an unwillingness to further support them if they associate with the Freedom Festival.

Guest performers for Stadium on Fire, MoTab, etc will start to view anything LDS based as toxic and stay away. Of course, there will always be 1 entertainer that needs a paycheck, but it will send a message.

Korihor wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:46 pm Guest performers for Stadium on Fire, MoTab, etc will start to view anything LDS based as toxic and stay away.

Nah, they will just be down to country singers who's livelihoods depend on being religious and right wing. See Chicks, Dixie.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:00 pm If I was in charge of the parade I would probably turn them away just out of concern for their own safety.

Can you imagine a float of LGBT youth parading down the street in Provo? They would either get booed, silenced, or shot by bullets made of jello.

I've been wondering this, as well. My son's pretty upset about this. It does send a very clear message that members of the LGBTQA aren't welcome.

Linked wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:54 pm . See Chicks, Dixie.

Searching: ... Chicks with Di... OMG! typo, DANG GOOGLE AUTOFILL!

I'm just not that surprised. Returning to Utah after living in other places for the past decade, the politics here really chap my hide. And it has been (somewhat) surprising to me just how dug in Utah Valley has become. So no, I'm not surprised about this.

I say give it five to ten years. There is not yet a critical mass of folks who just want to treat their LGBT neighbor with warmth and respect. I think, however, that it would be very difficult to be a young LGBT person there right now (either closeted or out). They need the support, and what the hell is wrong with a float?

My nephew is in a local marching band.

I loved my time in the band, both in high school and college. And I kind of liked being a band director. Sort of. I'm just glad I'm not involved with any of those midsummer parades anymore. Especially on the 24th of July. I don't know how we survived.

This makes my blood boil. For those of you saying "Well duh, what did you expect?" -I get your point based on history. But the church gets all bent out of shape over the Savannah fiasco blowing up. So they/lame bloggers blabber on about how they love gays, and brag about all the great things they do for them. MY ASS. Encircle is an organization that promotes tolerance and aims to prevent youth suicides??? The people who made the decision to exclude them are undoubtedly LDS.

LDS Inc, there is absolutely NOTHING whatsoever about you that resembles Christ's teachings. I hope this gains traction and makes news outlets, right on the heels of beautiful, brave Savannah.

StarbucksMom wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 10:44 pm This makes my blood boil. For those of you saying "Well duh, what did you expect?" -I get your point based on history. But the church gets all bent out of shape over the Savannah fiasco blowing up. So they/lame bloggers blabber on about how they love gays, and brag about all the great things they do for them. MY ASS. Encircle is an organization that promotes tolerance and aims to prevent youth suicides??? The people who made the decision to exclude them are undoubtedly LDS.

Yeah, I think you have a good point. I didn't make any kind of contextual connection between the Savannah fiasco and this float rejection until you mentioned it. It's easy for humans to be hypocrites who want to have it both ways. This very issue--the tension between the "love" the Church shows to LGBTs and the absolute line in the sand the Church feels like it has to keep publicly drawing,is what beat out of me any desire to be an active Mormon again. They just feel like they have to intrude on people's lives to police their sexuality in order for them to feel justified in the eyes of God. And they feel like they have to do it no matter what the consequences or collateral damage. If a few gay teens have to commit suicide in order for the Church to feel like it has proclaimed its truth to the world (and protected its religious freedom), well, the ends justify the means. Disturbing, disheartening, and disgusting.

And you know, I think we're still seeing blowback from Proposition 8. Can you imagine--your own fellow Americans, petitioning the government to make your marriage null and void (and the irony about the history of polygamy and the government is just too rich and summarily dismissed by TBMs--WTF?). If they came after your marriage, what would you do? How would you feel? How long would you feel it?

To be fair, any story about the LDS Church and LGBT issues is an easy target for certain folks online. Whether justified or not, it only triggers a seige mentality in TBMs and they will just dig in and complain about how they are being persecuted by the "world". Not the best strategy for getting Mormons to change.

Corsair wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 12:29 pmI truly wonder how America's Freedome Festival would react if some individual wanted to march and simply hold a banner with the URL to https://mormonandgay.lds.org/.

Most likely they would ban them just like they did Encircle.

Most Mormons don't really know the Church's official position on gays and lesbians. Church leaders don't seem to find it a high priority to change that.

Red Ryder wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:00 pm If I was in charge of the parade I would probably turn them away just out of concern for their own safety.

You've got to watch out with that sort of approach. It's generally used as one of the tools to maintain oppression. "We're just doing this for your own good /safety." When governments use that sort of approach to "protect" marginalized groups then they validate the violent approaches of the attackers and oppressors. It's similar to the idea of giving in to terrorists, granting them victory in their campaign.

The better approach would be for the organizers / officials to be clear in establishing their standards of conduct. The parade organizers could state clearly that they support freedom of expression and free speech and ask everyone to treat each other in a civil and respectful manner. Government and particularly police officials should state expectations for civil behavior and back that up with a sufficient on-hand police presence. I attended a parade this week in a Utah town and there was plenty of police presence to demonstrate their support of maintaining order at the event. Particularly in the family atmosphere of a patriotic parade in Utah, authoritarian statements such as these would pretty much eliminate any concerns regarding physical safety.

Given that, of course, each participant (or parent / guardian if minor) would still have to assess their own concerns regarding safety. It is possible they could still face boos, criticism, or other derogatory comments. Parade organizers and government officials could do much to alleviate that but not to eliminate the chance entirely. Each participant could evaluate their concerns regarding these issues. Or merely the impact of the publicity.

I LOVE ENCIRCLE!! I've been following this play out on Reddit and Facebook. Send them a donation if you can! I'm a Utah county resident and we need them so very much.

https://encircletogether.org/donate/

I can see where the parade committee is coming from. If their religious leaders are intolerant then the committee feels it is their duty to be intolerant as well.

On a personal level, they can work to change this situation one heart at a time, as can we on this board. In the meantime, we can giggle at the irony that this parade is named "Freedom Festival".

moksha wrote: ↑Thu Jul 06, 2017 9:43 pm I can see where the parade committee is coming from. If their religious leaders are intolerant then the committee feels it is their duty to be intolerant as well.

On a personal level, they can work to change this situation one heart at a time, as can we on this board. In the meantime, we can giggle at the irony that this parade is named "Freedom Festival".

Yes, we need to change the punctuation around the title. It could be:

• "Freedom" Festival

Or, perhaps:

• Freedom* Festival

* Some limitations on "Freedom" may apply, especially if you're gay

Linked wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:54 pm

Korihor wrote: ↑Wed Jul 05, 2017 2:46 pm Guest performers for Stadium on Fire, MoTab, etc will start to view anything LDS based as toxic and stay away.

Nah, they will just be down to country singers who's livelihoods depend on being religious and right wing. See Chicks, Dixie.

Um, yeah, that's what they get now.