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I don't know, but when I was younger, the church leaders would put signs in their front yards supporting their preferred political candidates. They didn't always agree. I'm sure they had a few laughs over their Sprites and green jello about how this practice impacted the neighbors. Alas, they don't do it, anymore. I know that Mckonkie used to be the token Democrat.oliver_denom wrote: ↑Fri Jun 23, 2017 7:30 am I heard reference in another thread that there are whisperings about a significant division among the 12 as far as the future direction of the church is involved. Does anyone have any better reference for this and to what those divisions might be? Who are the reformers, and what is their idea of reform?
You might be thinking of Elder Hugh Brown. Bruce McConkie was a Republican, however, his father Oscar McConkie was a Democrat.
moksha wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 1:58 amYou might be thinking of Elder Hugh Brown. Bruce McConkie was a Republican, however, his father Oscar McConkie was a Democrat.
Heard that the Brethren have vigorous discussions. Wonder if many of those discussions center around whether to open their eggs from the little or the big end?
The large end is usually where the air pocket is located and is, therefore, easier. I have it on faith promoting rumor that this is the nature of the debate:
Give It Time, that was funny and real and..... sobering. And especially very, very real. Before mormonism fell apart for me, I had begun to believe in a God who was all about men, who wouldn't answer my pleas because it wasn't in the interest of the man involved - and he was primarily forwarding the purpose and interest of men. I, as a woman, existed for the purpose, benefit, and pleasure of man - not unlike a milk cow as mormon elder Heber Kimball so famously implied.Give It Time wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:55 amThe large end is usually where the air pocket is located and is, therefore, easier. I have it on faith promoting rumor that this is the nature of the debate:
Is the easy way the Lord's way because He designed the egg that way and He gave us this blessing and we should enjoy it and open the egg at the large end?
Or
Opening the egg at the large end is the Satan's way, because 1) it's easy and not straight and narrow and 2) the air pocket is not always at the large end and that leads to one being deceived. That can lead to frustration and throwing the egg on the wall, thus destroying the egg, making it Satan's way, because he is the destroyer. Finally, one's wife now has to clean the egg off the wall. She doesn't appreciate it and snaps at one to not blame the egg, God or the Devil for one's jerky behavior. This causes strain in the marriage and is, therefore, of the Devil.
But agreement is reached when
One of them speaks up and says, the woman should always drop the egg in water before cooking it to ensure she is serving her Lord and Master the freshest eggs, every morning. The air pocket is consistently at the large end, making the whole operation easier and facilitates the toast point dipping. Therefore this whole discussion and situation is the woman's fault. She could avoid so much trouble being rained down on her head and the lesson being taught by her having to clean egg off the wall. We'll be sure to include this example as a resource in the next lesson about honoring the priesthood.
Then the wives with a modicum of self respect they've been taught from the cradle to have in order to avoid being raped will angrily look up from canning peaches and sewing bonnets while changing diapers to tell them to
Go baptize your own damned eggs, if you'll notice, we're a little busy here. If you're going to insist that your eggs be baptized every morning before cooking them is honoring your priesthood, then give me the priesthood, because we all know I don't have the authority to dunk those stupid eggs.
Then men really come together and unite to discipline any upstart woman who isn't happy about canning peaches, sewing bonnets and changing diapers while baptizing and cooking eggs and making toast points. The women will now feel inadequate because they can't accomplish all that, or if they can, they don't feel joy in it.
This results in
Most men getting eggs with the air pocket in the correct place.
If the air pocket is in the incorrect place and the egg gets thrown against the wall, it is loving discipline and not unrighteous dominion and the sister will be reminded to go to the temple to remember her covenants.
Sometimes, a perfectly good egg will get thrown against the wall to remind the woman who is in charge. Even if she gives her husband perfect eggs, every morning, he will not appreciate her efforts, but occasionally throw the egg against the wall. It's very important for it to seem random, unpredictable and crazy.
The women will feel inadequate and/or no sense of joy and will be instructed to go to the temple to be reminded of their covenants.
The unrighteous women who just won't shake that pesky self-respect will be disciplined, starting with egg throwing and in ever increasing seriousness until she realizes her eggs-altation is at stake.
All's right with the world.*
*To COB lurkers: as I wrote this post, it started out humorous and I was chuckling as I wrote it. As I kept going, this truly is a story that rings to the truth of my experience, although the item thrown was not eggs. I'm sure I'm not alone and I'm sure we'd all be shocked at how common this is. If this post offends you, I apologise. It offended me to experience it. It was my experience, in every day in varying degrees of seriousness for more than twenty years. Rather than getting angry at the women stuck in the system, get angry at the system. Rather than telling women to have faith because we don't know why things are the way they are, let me tell you that sometimes the thing being thrown against the wall is a human being. Precisely how many people need to be thrown against the wall before we've exhibited enough faith? Again, I'm sorry if this offends. It was offensive to experience it, all of it--including the counsel given--first hand.
I'm going to go write something more uplifting and then I'm going to go do something else.
Give It Time wrote: ↑Sat Jun 24, 2017 4:55 amThe large end is usually where the air pocket is located and is, therefore, easier. I have it on faith promoting rumor that this is the nature of the debate:
Is the easy way the Lord's way because He designed the egg that way and He gave us this blessing and we should enjoy it and open the egg at the large end?
Or
Opening the egg at the large end is the Satan's way, because 1) it's easy and not straight and narrow and 2) the air pocket is not always at the large end and that leads to one being deceived. That can lead to frustration and throwing the egg on the wall, thus destroying the egg, making it Satan's way, because he is the destroyer. Finally, one's wife now has to clean the egg off the wall. She doesn't appreciate it and snaps at one to not blame the egg, God or the Devil for one's jerky behavior. This causes strain in the marriage and is, therefore, of the Devil.
But agreement is reached when
One of them speaks up and says, the woman should always drop the egg in water before cooking it to ensure she is serving her Lord and Master the freshest eggs, every morning. The air pocket is consistently at the large end, making the whole operation easier and facilitates the toast point dipping. Therefore this whole discussion and situation is the woman's fault. She could avoid so much trouble being rained down on her head and the lesson being taught by her having to clean egg off the wall. We'll be sure to include this example as a resource in the next lesson about honoring the priesthood.
Then the wives with a modicum of self respect they've been taught from the cradle to have in order to avoid being raped will angrily look up from canning peaches and sewing bonnets while changing diapers to tell them to
Go baptize your own damned eggs, if you'll notice, we're a little busy here. If you're going to insist that your eggs be baptized every morning before cooking them is honoring your priesthood, then give me the priesthood, because we all know I don't have the authority to dunk those stupid eggs.
Then men really come together and unite to discipline any upstart woman who isn't happy about canning peaches, sewing bonnets and changing diapers while baptizing and cooking eggs and making toast points. The women will now feel inadequate because they can't accomplish all that, or if they can, they don't feel joy in it.
This results in
Most men getting eggs with the air pocket in the correct place.
If the air pocket is in the incorrect place and the egg gets thrown against the wall, it is loving discipline and not unrighteous dominion and the sister will be reminded to go to the temple to remember her covenants.
Sometimes, a perfectly good egg will get thrown against the wall to remind the woman who is in charge. Even if she gives her husband perfect eggs, every morning, he will not appreciate her efforts, but occasionally throw the egg against the wall. It's very important for it to seem random, unpredictable and crazy.
The women will feel inadequate and/or no sense of joy and will be instructed to go to the temple to be reminded of their covenants.
The unrighteous women who just won't shake that pesky self-respect will be disciplined, starting with egg throwing and in ever increasing seriousness until she realizes her eggs-altation is at stake.
All's right with the world.*
*To COB lurkers: as I wrote this post, it started out humorous and I was chuckling as I wrote it. As I kept going, this truly is a story that rings to the truth of my experience, although the item thrown was not eggs. I'm sure I'm not alone and I'm sure we'd all be shocked at how common this is. If this post offends you, I apologise. It offended me to experience it. It was my experience, in every day in varying degrees of seriousness for more than twenty years. Rather than getting angry at the women stuck in the system, get angry at the system. Rather than telling women to have faith because we don't know why things are the way they are, let me tell you that sometimes the thing being thrown against the wall is a human being. Precisely how many people need to be thrown against the wall before we've exhibited enough faith? Again, I'm sorry if this offends. It was offensive to experience it, all of it--including the counsel given--first hand.
I'm going to go write something more uplifting and then I'm going to go do something else.
It would sure be nice if they would clue in.
With grudging apologies to Hannah Last Cornaby and Hymn number 260:
I heard this too from Bednar. He hosted a special FHE when I was at BYU-I and he was president. Any way we got to ask him questions but before we did he gave us examples of questions we should ask, and then he proceeded to answer those questions. One of the questions we should have asked was something like: "President Bednar, you are privileged to spend a lot of time with the quorum of the 12, what have you learned in working so closely with the apostles of God?" Part of his response was that they did have really heated discussions sometimes. It kind of shocked me that he told us that. The narrative you get at church is that they are all PSRs and talk to God and God talks through them; so you wouldn't think they would argue. I wonder if Bednar would respond the same way (to his own question
) now that he is one of them?
?