NOM

Not Buying It wrote: ↑Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:36 pm Week 1 will be a train wreck. Without training on how to conduct a focused discussion with a large group of people, in most cases it will unravel, pretty quickly. One or two people having the same conversation once a month while everyone else looks at their phones. It's a really poorly thought through idea.

This is going to be a new instance of leadership roulette. Some quorums are going to be gossip central, some will be boring topics, and a few will be a new introduction for the Gospel Topic essays. A few might even end up being useful and get an appropriate write up in the "Ensign". Some lucky quorums might be more useful than can be tolerated by a church magazine because it involves clever solutions and discussions that are too edgy for the institutional church. This might be the time to do a refresher course on dialectic and rhetoric since the talents of Cicero and Aristotle will rule the day.

Yeah, the women do look at their phones, because they're using them in lieu of scriptures, manual and songbook.

Not to get too far off topic, but this sounds to me like a cost cutting measure. Killing the prophet manuals means cutting resources on developing, writing, editing, correlation review, publishing, and printing those manuals every year. The COB conversation likely went like this. "Why are we spending all of this money on developing these books, and spending all this time and money writing and giving conference talks twice a year? Let's offset declining revenues by eliminating the books, then have the members use our conference talks on Sundays. Win, win. That's what Tommy would want, right Tommy?"

My question is have they done all the modern prophets? I don't know when this started and how many they have gone through, but I thought they were getting close to the end of having a new person each year. It is possible that this concept has simply run it's course and it's time to go on to the next thing.

Why on earth did they ever teach about what dead prophets taught? They are dead. The teachings of the living bretheren override what they said anyway. Am I right?

Just This Guy wrote: ↑Mon Nov 06, 2017 4:59 pm My question is have they done all the modern prophets? I don't know when this started and how many they have gone through, but I thought they were getting close to the end of having a new person each year. It is possible that this concept has simply run it's course and it's time to go on to the next thing.

Pretty much this. They ran out of dead prophets. It's possible they could have done a TSM manual for 2018 but maybe they didn't feel comfortable breaking the mold in having a manual with the sitting (albeit incapacitated) prophet.

Over time the teachings manuals evolved into excerpts from [drum roll] conference talks. So nothing is really changing. We'll just be rehashing conference talks from different people.

History:
It all started in 1998 with the BY manual. Some manuals included enough lessons to cover two years and there was a two year period somewhere in the middle where we didn't do a teachings manual and we covered the lessons in the gospel principles manual instead. But we've covered all the past presidents of the church now.

- - -

And it does smack of cost shaving/laziness. Why put together new lesson materials that could spark renewed interest in attending PH/RS ( ) when they can put in no effort whatsoever and rehash material that bores people so much that they stop attending 3rd hour. Then on first Sunday we can talk about how everyone doesn't attend 3rd hour anymore because of a problem with them and not a problem with the meeting they'd be expected to attend.

1smartdodog wrote: ↑Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:30 pm I dislike lessons based on conference talks. Its just one GA quoting a previous GA. Whats the point of having scriptures anymore. We don't use them.

I am so sick of that. Talks are all pretty much based on conference talks. Now most of the lessons are based on conference talks. Every time I hear a talk or a lesson based on a conference talk I can't keep up with who is "speaking". Is it the person giving the lesson, the GA that gave the talk, the GA that the GA is quoting or the prophet or scripture that the GA is quoting that is being quoted by the GA giving the talk that the teacher is quoting.

It's like that movie Inception for conference talks. You go down too many "quote" layers and you end up in unorganized "talk" space where you forget your humanity and time stands still.

Culper Jr. wrote: ↑Mon Nov 06, 2017 7:49 pm

1smartdodog wrote: ↑Sun Nov 05, 2017 8:30 pm I dislike lessons based on conference talks. Its just one GA quoting a previous GA. Whats the point of having scriptures anymore. We don't use them.

I am so sick of that. Talks are all pretty much based on conference talks. Now most of the lessons are based on conference talks. Every time I hear a talk or a lesson based on a conference talk I can't keep up with who is "speaking". Is it the person giving the lesson, the GA that gave the talk, the GA that the GA is quoting or the prophet or scripture that the GA is quoting that is being quoted by the GA giving the talk that the teacher is quoting.

It's like that movie Inception for conference talks. You go down too many "quote" layers and you end up in unorganized "talk" space where you forget your humanity and time stands still.

The Brethren are trying to shore up their authority. They spend a lot of time trying to indoctrinate the members to think they are these amazing leaders, because the reality is that they are boring, one-dimensional, uninspired and uninspiring old men no one in their right mind would ever follow if they hadn't been indoctrinated.

There will be better attendance on first Sunday. People will attend to keep from being the subject of discussion. So at least one week will be well attended.

FiveFingerMnemonic wrote: ↑Sun Nov 05, 2017 7:59 pm HP group is the only meeting where I don't have enough charity to make it through a lesson. The old man dogma is just too hard to overcome. Interesting format change. I can see the gossip being terrible. Even worse than high counsel meetings.

Plus old men have that...old man smell

I'm hoping for open microphone Sunday. When in quorum, you can talk openly about what is bothering you. This might make the meeting entertaining.

2bizE wrote: ↑Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:54 am I'm hoping for open microphone Sunday. When in quorum, you can talk openly about what is bothering you. This might make the meeting entertaining.

I think that's what 1st Sunday RS will eventually devolve too. But I don't know, maybe it would turn out to be a good thing. There is so much passive-aggressiveness, and there is this charade of perfectionism in RS. Maybe this will help us all see that no one is really happy and no one is really perfect.

Does anyone think one week of an open topic discussion would be beneficial or could that fall within the rubric of magnifying your calling?

The one thing I hate most about church talks (or lessons now!) based on GC talks is hearing the speaker say, "Well, I can't say it any better than the general authority said it," and then begins to read long sections to fill up the time.

I mean, it was bad enough the first time, and now it is even worse having it read again!

I always want to shout out at this point, "Yes! You can say it better! In fact, anybody could say it better!"

consiglieri wrote: ↑Thu Nov 09, 2017 10:59 am The one thing I hate most about church talks (or lessons now!) based on GC talks is hearing the speaker say, "Well, I can't say it any better than the general authority said it," and then begins to read long sections to fill up the time.

I mean, it was bad enough the first time, and now it is even worse having it read again!

I always want to shout out at this point, "Yes! You can say it better! In fact, anybody could say it better!"

I agree. I not only hate listening to talks from GC, I even dislike more hearing them again in church.

2bizE wrote: ↑Wed Nov 08, 2017 6:54 am I'm hoping for open microphone Sunday. When in quorum, you can talk openly about what is bothering you. This might make the meeting entertaining.

Yeah, but when I've seen that happen in my ward it often becomes an apostate bashing session.

Give It Time wrote: ↑Mon Nov 06, 2017 3:56 pm Yeah, the women do look at their phones, because they're using them in lieu of scriptures, manual and songbook.

The most inspired thing church leaders have done in this dispensation is to put the scriptures on an app, so no one can tell which of the standard works you're reading: the Book of Mormon, the Bible, NOM or Exmormon Reddit.

Hagoth wrote: ↑Fri Nov 10, 2017 7:02 am

Give It Time wrote: ↑Mon Nov 06, 2017 3:56 pm Yeah, the women do look at their phones, because they're using them in lieu of scriptures, manual and songbook.

The most inspired thing church leaders have done in this dispensation is to put the scriptures on an app, so no one can tell which of the standard works you're reading: the Book of Mormon, the Bible, NOM or Exmormon Reddit.

Apparently, they know when I visit Reddit some places became it is blocked. I think mormon think is too.

2bizE wrote: ↑Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:35 pm

Hagoth wrote: ↑Fri Nov 10, 2017 7:02 am

Give It Time wrote: ↑Mon Nov 06, 2017 3:56 pm Yeah, the women do look at their phones, because they're using them in lieu of scriptures, manual and songbook.

The most inspired thing church leaders have done in this dispensation is to put the scriptures on an app, so no one can tell which of the standard works you're reading: the Book of Mormon, the Bible, NOM or Exmormon Reddit.

Apparently, they know when I visit Reddit some places became it is blocked. I think mormon think is too.

I guess you'd better just read Breitbart and Fox News in church, then.