Apologetics

[Linked]

(From here: http://nautil.us/blog/you-want-to-see-m ... re-friends. About how acadamia has screwed up science. But this panel is apologetics in a nutshell.)

[jfro18]

I'm totally stealing that

[alas]

And politicians who are owned by the oil and gas companies on global warming.

[Red Ryder]

Not going to go into politics with this but here’s the real life version:



What frustrates me is my wife and family. They can sense some things within Mormonism aren’t what they claim to be but still decide to close their minds and not pursue their gut feelings.

So close but so far away.

So frustrating.

[Hagoth]

It's hard to imagine a gun that could produce more smoke than the Book of Abraham, yet people listen to the lamest, intentionally deceptive excuses about it from apologists and just nod and say, "yup, sounds legit to me!"

[Red Ryder]

It's hard to imagine a gun that could produce more smoke than the Book of Abraham, yet people listen to the lamest, intentionally deceptive excuses about it from apologists and just nod and say, "yup, sounds legit to me!"

What’s your top 5 smoking guns ranked in order of apologetic lameness?

[jfro18]

What frustrates me is my wife and family. They can sense some things within Mormonism aren’t what they claim to be but still decide to close their minds and not pursue their gut feelings.

So close but so far away.

So frustrating.

We went to visit DW's parents on their senior mission last year with my sis-in-law (the one who reported me to the family for posting that the Saints book was not an accurate history), and we had three conversations that were so perfectly paralleled to Mormonism that I had to fight every urge not to bring it up.

The best one was about a politician who did an interview about a life experience but then changed that story when they wrote a book to try and launch a national profile... so clearly they either made up the story entirely or exaggerated it to a massive degree to sell books and gain a following.

And I was kind of making comments that in my head were directed at church because I happen to interact with a lot of political people online so I could honestly say the replies I was getting were "Even if they changed the story, the story feels true to me and I believe it."

So my in-laws and sis-in-law both were in full agreement that *those* people were crazy, and then my father in law turns to me and says "You used to be able to get away with stuff like this before Google, but now you just can't make up a story and expect people not to figure it out."

I was screaming internally... I just could not believe the irony and had I said that was the First Vision, they wouldn't tossed me out the window.

[Red Ryder]

Is there a quick list or chart somewhere that lists out all of the apologists and their area of expertise? Or trading cards with stats and rankings?

If not someone should make that.

[alas]

What frustrates me is my wife and family. They can sense some things within Mormonism aren’t what they claim to be but still decide to close their minds and not pursue their gut feelings.

So close but so far away.

So frustrating.

We went to visit DW's parents on their senior mission last year with my sis-in-law (the one who reported me to the family for posting that the Saints book was not an accurate history), and we had three conversations that were so perfectly paralleled to Mormonism that I had to fight every urge not to bring it up.

The best one was about a politician who did an interview about a life experience but then changed that story when they wrote a book to try and launch a national profile... so clearly they either made up the story entirely or exaggerated it to a massive degree to sell books and gain a following.

And I was kind of making comments that in my head were directed at church because I happen to interact with a lot of political people online so I could honestly say the replies I was getting were "Even if they changed the story, the story feels true to me and I believe it."

So my in-laws and sis-in-law both were in full agreement that *those* people were crazy, and then my father in law turns to me and says "You used to be able to get away with stuff like this before Google, but now you just can't make up a story and expect people not to figure it out."

I was screaming internally... I just could not believe the irony and had I said that was the First Vision, they wouldn't tossed me out the window.

Yes, this is what makes me crazy. The “made up” or “exaggerated“ story....well, I can think of one Democrat that that applies to and a couple of Republicans. But the Republicans are pointing a finger at the Democrat and yelling liar liar liar, but defending the Republicans guilty of the same thing and the Democrats are pointing at the Republicans and yelling Liar liar liar, while totally believing and supporting their guy/gal. Look at the behavior, fact check it to make sure it isn’t just an accusation by the other side (let’s face it, some of these stories are made up or exaggerated for political purposes) and then hold the person accountable for what they actually did, not what you want to be true.

And yes, I have heard people outright say that they want X to be true, so they are going to believe in X no matter the “facts” and they go along happily believing their alternate reality. And a Republican invented the term “alternate reality“ because they knew they were ignoring all the facts of the case, so people KNOW they are doing it.

[Phil Lurkerman]

(From here: http://nautil.us/blog/you-want-to-see-m ... re-friends. About how acadamia has screwed up science. But this panel is apologetics in a nutshell.)

After recording the contents of the meeting, Talmage uncharacteristically then recorded his
feelings about what he heard:

I know the Book of Mormon to be a true record; and many of the “difficulties”, or
objections as critics would urge, are after all but negative in their nature. The Book of
Mormon states that Lehi and his colony found horses upon this continent when they
arrived; and therefore horses were here at that time.

Montez, S. C. (2019). The Secret Mormon Meetings of 1922 [Thesis]. https://scholarworks.unr.edu//handle/11714/6712

[jfro18]

Yes, this is what makes me crazy. The “made up” or “exaggerated“ story....well, I can think of one Democrat that that applies to and a couple of Republicans. But the Republicans are pointing a finger at the Democrat and yelling liar liar liar, but defending the Republicans guilty of the same thing and the Democrats are pointing at the Republicans and yelling Liar liar liar, while totally believing and supporting their guy/gal. Look at the behavior, fact check it to make sure it isn’t just an accusation by the other side (let’s face it, some of these stories are made up or exaggerated for political purposes) and then hold the person accountable for what they actually did, not what you want to be true.

And yes, I have heard people outright say that they want X to be true, so they are going to believe in X no matter the “facts” and they go along happily believing their alternate reality. And a Republican invented the term “alternate reality“ because they knew they were ignoring all the facts of the case, so people KNOW they are doing it.

I won't delve too much into politics, but it really does mirror the Mormonism aspect where you just throw our logical thinking when it impacts "your team."

I've been very engaged in politics on Twitter since 2012, and I can say without question it has gotten MUCH worse over the last 8 years... and the responses I got in 2015 when I said Trump was awful from a lot of Republicans were just insane. I'm not Jewish but I received a good number of references to getting gassed like that... so fundamentalism is not reserved for just religion.

As for your 'Alternative Facts' reference, I've always found this artwork funny:

[blazerb]

Is there a quick list or chart somewhere that lists out all of the apologists and their area of expertise? Or trading cards with stats and rankings?

If not someone should make that.

Kind of like Foxe's Book of Martyrs but with comedy and without the death.