Two private jets for Nelson and co

[no1saint]

https://youtu.be/LXAgraikkjU

[Hagoth]

Sheesh. One jet should be called Purse and the other Scrip.

[moksha]

They are off on another trip to South America.

[Palerider]

They couldn't just fly commercial 1st class?

Your tithing dollars at work. "We have sufficient for our needs."

[Palerider]

Both of these aircraft are registered to charter companies. Now whether the church owns these companies or not is another question. However, with the number of people that have to accompany Nelson it makes financial sense to charter these planes rather than fly everyone first class. I mean he deserves nothing less. Right?

I wouldn't be surprised if this is the way they look at it.

Some of these islands, like Tonga aren't that easy to get in and out of. I'm sure they're thinking if they charter the jets, they can fly in, fly out on their own schedule and get the "Word of the Lord" to members in a more timely fashion. Plus they aren't stuck in a hotel overnight waiting for a flight out the next day.

The church is all about efficiency, if not efficacy.

[alas]

Both of these aircraft are registered to charter companies. Now whether the church owns these companies or not is another question. However, with the number of people that have to accompany Nelson it makes financial sense to charter these planes rather than fly everyone first class. I mean he deserves nothing less. Right?

I wouldn't be surprised if this is the way they look at it.

Some of these islands, like Tonga aren't that easy to get in and out of. I'm sure they're thinking if they charter the jets, they can fly in, fly out on their own schedule and get the "Word of the Lord" to members in a more timely fashion. Plus they aren't stuck in a hotel overnight waiting for a flight out the next day.

The church is all about efficiency, if not efficacy.

I think I heard some where that some very wealthy Mormon family/company loans their private jets to the church for such use, free of charge, so the church isn’t paying anything for the jets, except throwing their political weight behind that company. So, I suspect that this criticism is unwarranted. Now, when you see the church throw all kinds of political pressure behind a particular company, then you can criticize. I kinda, sorta remember it was someone like Huntsman senior, but don’t quote me cause I may have the supper rich family wrong.

[Stig]

Both of these aircraft are registered to charter companies. Now whether the church owns these companies or not is another question. However, with the number of people that have to accompany Nelson it makes financial sense to charter these planes rather than fly everyone first class. I mean he deserves nothing less. Right?

I wouldn't be surprised if this is the way they look at it.

Some of these islands, like Tonga aren't that easy to get in and out of. I'm sure they're thinking if they charter the jets, they can fly in, fly out on their own schedule and get the "Word of the Lord" to members in a more timely fashion. Plus they aren't stuck in a hotel overnight waiting for a flight out the next day.

The church is all about efficiency, if not efficacy.

I think I heard some where that some very wealthy Mormon family/company loans their private jets to the church for such use, free of charge, so the church isn’t paying anything for the jets, except throwing their political weight behind that company. So, I suspect that this criticism is unwarranted. Now, when you see the church throw all kinds of political pressure behind a particular company, then you can criticize. I kinda, sorta remember it was someone like Huntsman senior, but don’t quote me cause I may have the supper rich family wrong.

It was Huntsman. Don't know the status of their little arrangement, though. It's been years since this issue came to light.

[Red Ryder]

Sorry guys, I needed the tax write off this year so I loaned them a few planes.

I hope he returns them clean before Labor Day. I have places to be with my entourage.

[Hagoth]

They couldn't just fly commercial 1st class?

And settle for a meal with only three courses? No masseuse? No pedicure?

I hear people talking about how Pres. Nelson is sacrificing his golden years for The Lord. As far a sacrifice goes let's compare the sacrifice of seniors who sit in the temple all day listening to the same masonic rites over and over again to Nelson's sacrifice of flying around the world in luxury to exotic places where people are falling all over themselves to touch the hem of his garment.

[blazerb]

They couldn't just fly commercial 1st class?

Your tithing dollars at work. "We have sufficient for our needs."

I remember being told when I was a youth many years ago that GA's flew commercial. It was not just about the money. It was about having opportunities to share the gospel. I may have been told that they flew coach, but looking back on it that makes no sense. You can't meet Mick Jagger flying coach. (Referring to this story: http://mormonmonsters.blogspot.com/2009 ... agger.html.)

Coming in with two charter jets creates the rock star entrance, but only members would care. I think the Q15 really believe they are the most important people in the world, unless they are supplicating the pope maybe.

[moksha]

Some of these islands, like Tonga aren't that easy to get in and out of. I'm sure they're thinking if they charter the jets, they can fly in, fly out on their own schedule and get the "Word of the Lord" to members in a more timely fashion. Plus they aren't stuck in a hotel overnight waiting for a flight out the next day.

So no vacation time for Sisters Wendy and Sheri? Not that they would particularly like to see the Christ the Redeemer statue in Rio de Janeiro, but still, all work and no play...

[moksha]

You can't meet Mick Jagger flying coach. (Referring to this story: http://mormonmonsters.blogspot.com/2009 ... agger.html.)

Or meeting Elvis: viewtopic.php?f=7&t=633&start=40 Head down to the Thu Feb 22, 2018 post.

[Emower]

Finances were one of the earliest items on my shelf. Money has been a defining struggle of my life. Because of choices I made in the pursuit of the Mormon ideal, I will always struggle to make ends meet. So, from that angle, and in thinking about what Nelson said to the African people, it's hard to make a case for the church hierarchy not dining off the fatted calf.

[Not Buying It]

Let’s pretend for a moment that the private jets are being used free of charge, although none of us really know if that’s the case. It would still be an instance of President Nelson using his power and influence to get something normal members do not have access to, which in my opinion is wrong. When Church leaders with certain positions get perks, it sends a message that, to paraphrase George Orwell, “all members are equal, but some members are more equal than others”. How many of you have access to a private jet to fulfill your calling in the Church? At the other extreme, how many of you are Primary teachers who pay for lesson materials with your own money because the Church doesn’t budget for any?

I get it, the Brethren love being rock stars, teachings by Christ about the dangers of pride be damned. But this is just one of many ways that we all pay into a system we do not all benefit from equally. Of course, that kind of thinking goes all the way back to Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, but private jets convey a message to the members that “we are better than you”. Which is how they want it I guess, but I personally don’t believe it is right.

[Advocate]

Let’s pretend for a moment that the private jets are being used free of charge, although none of us really know if that’s the case. It would still be an instance of President Nelson using his power and influence to get something normal members do not have access to, which in my opinion is wrong. When Church leaders with certain positions get perks, it sends a message that, to paraphrase George Orwell, “all members are equal, but some members are more equal than others”. How many of you have access to a private jet to fulfill your calling in the Church? At the other extreme, how many of you are Primary teachers who pay for lesson materials with your own money because the Church doesn’t budget for any?

I get it, the Brethren love being rock stars, teachings by Christ about the dangers of pride be damned. But this is just one of many ways that we all pay into a system we do not all benefit from equally. Of course, that kind of thinking goes all the way back to Joseph Smith and Brigham Young, but private jets convey a message to the members that “we are better than you”. Which is how they want it I guess, but I personally don’t believe it is right.

+1. Love this quote.

Supposedly the Huntsman corporation has it written into their bylaws that they provide a plane for the church for free (no cost to church), but they aren't using a Huntsman plane here. The plane they were on is registered to Shortstop Jet Charter of Australia. Shortstop advertises themselves as:

Premium, luxurious jet charter services with the highest safety standards in Australia

We have no way of knowing whether the church paid directly, or someone paid on the church's behalf.

At our local ward level, things couldn't be further from premium, luxurious services.

[Hagoth]

Anybody want to hazard a guess at the dollar value of this little outing, regardless of who was footing the bill?

[Emower]

Let’s pretend for a moment that the private jets are being used free of charge, although none of us really know if that’s the case. It would still be an instance of President Nelson using his power and influence to get something normal members do not have access to, which in my opinion is wrong. When Church leaders with certain positions get perks, it sends a message that, to paraphrase George Orwell, “all members are equal, but some members are more equal than others”.

I get what you are saying, and I dont disagree. But if we draw that kind of comparison we also need to take expectations into account. How many of us have an expectation to travel the world in our callings? Could he fly coach? Sure. Does he need an entourage requiring 2 planes? No.

If this church is supposed to be as Jesus centered as possible that money should be given to the poor and the Pres. should be staying on an air mattress in some members home. I would even be OK if he splurged on a fancy air mattress, since he is 97 after all.

[Red Ryder]

Let’s pretend for a moment that the private jets are being used free of charge, although none of us really know if that’s the case. It would still be an instance of President Nelson using his power and influence to get something normal members do not have access to, which in my opinion is wrong. When Church leaders with certain positions get perks, it sends a message that, to paraphrase George Orwell, “all members are equal, but some members are more equal than others”.

I get what you are saying, and I dont disagree. But if we draw that kind of comparison we also need to take expectations into account. How many of us have an expectation to travel the world in our callings? Could he fly coach? Sure. Does he need an entourage requiring 2 planes? No.

If this church is supposed to be as Jesus centered as possible that money should be given to the poor and the Pres. should be staying on an air mattress in some members home. I would even be OK if he splurged on a fancy air mattress, since he is 97 after all.

You mean he should be staying in a hay barn sleeping in a manger because Motel 6 had no vacancy.

There’s a lot of valid bitching and whining amongst the former TBM’s on the Internet. I just get tired of the “What would Jesus do” comparison to the church. It’s annoying when we’ve all figured out the obvious that the church doesn’t follow the teachings of Jesus yet we still complain as if we expect it to.

Well duh? The church is a billion dollar corporation and that’s what the executive leadership teams of billion dollar corporations do. They fly on private planes at the expense of their customers and shareholders.

Can we stop pretending like the church is actually a church and then complain when it doesn’t act like a church?

Humanitarian - Nope
Honesty - Nope
Follow Jesus - Nope
Give to the poor - Nope
Feed the hungry - Nope
Clothe the Naked - Yup with weird under wear
Buy real estate - Yup
Stock portfolio - Yup
Hold fan boy conferences - yup
Travel the world - Yup
Vacation in Hawaii - Yup

Act like a church - don’t be silly!

[Exiled]

Why not give him 93 private jets? He could be the Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh of private jets.

[Palerider]

I get what you are saying, and I dont disagree. But if we draw that kind of comparison we also need to take expectations into account. How many of us have an expectation to travel the world in our callings? Could he fly coach? Sure. Does he need an entourage requiring 2 planes? No.

If this church is supposed to be as Jesus centered as possible that money should be given to the poor and the Pres. should be staying on an air mattress in some members home. I would even be OK if he splurged on a fancy air mattress, since he is 97 after all.

Isn't there some room in the middle here?

Wouldn't bother me to see a smaller entourage, flying 1st class on one of the better airlines and then staying in nice, moderate accomodations. Aren't Mormons famous for that "moderation in all things" saying??

I acknowledge the guy's age. He needs a little comfort and some caretakers. I certainly wouldn't begrudge him that.

Maybe it's Aunt Wendy and some of his inner circle who are pushing the "We're the most important people on Earth" mentality so "go big or stay home". I'm sure they would only be motivated by pure intentions.