Sam Young to be excommunicated from Ziontology on September 9

[Reuben]

Apparently, Sam has committed spiritual adultery by repeatedly making The Brethren look bad. The kangaroo court has been scheduled:

https://invisiblescubit.wordpress.com/2 ... on-notice/

Oh, Sam. If only you had cared more about Ziontology and less about children and following Jesus.

On the plus side, he's been expecting this and probably has a great plan.

[moksha]

I think it may be engraved into the Unwritten Rules that "Thou shall not impede bishops from inquiring into the sex lives of minors since it is one of the job perks". If Sam Young broke this unwritten rule then he is subject to a Kangaroo Court of Love.

Wonder which General Authority is heading this excommunication?

[crossmyheart]

I used to truly believe in the scripture verses that talked about the wheat separated from the chaff. Turns out I still do. The church doesn't deserve him.

[MoPag]

I used to truly believe in the scripture verses that talked about the wheat separated from the chaff. Turns out I still do. The church doesn't deserve him.

Amen to this!!!^^^

I guess we all saw this coming. But I still felt like I got punched in the stomach when I saw it on FB last night.

September 9th is a new moon. It's a symbol of death, but it's also a promise of rebirth. I will mourn with Sam as his old religion cuts him off, and I will rejoice with him as he starts on his new spiritual path.

[Corsair]

It felt inevitable, yet I hoped that the LDS church would simply ignore Sam and not make him a martyr. Sam is getting the same treatment as John Dehlin because once Sam is not longer an official member, the church can hope that his cause is ignored by all right thinking Mormons. But the apostles seem determined to shoot themselves in the foot yet again and now get to enjoy being called "Ziontologists" by an increasingly vocal community.

[RS Teacher]

I know this is a really naive question, but what exactly did he do that justifies excommunication? I'm not at all surprised by this, and yet I sort of am. What rationalization is the church using to explain why he's being ex-ed? Don't they still try to maintain at least the illusion that a person has to have committed some kind of actual sin in order to be excommunicated?

[Kishkumen]

Ziontology, Zionetics, Ziontologist are some of the best nicknames and puns the unloyal opposition have come up with yet.

Sam is lovingly summoned to his day in Kangaroo Court because he voted opposed to the leadership and then publicly protested their policies and tried to get others to join his cause. The public hunger strike in an attempt to get other faithful members to join him in opposition to their divine leadership was the final trigger.

[MoPag]

I know this is a really naive question, but what exactly did he do that justifies excommunication? I'm not at all surprised by this, and yet I sort of am. What rationalization is the church using to explain why he's being ex-ed? Don't they still try to maintain at least the illusion that a person has to have committed some kind of actual sin in order to be excommunicated?

His letter says he was acting in opposition to the church and its leaders.

[dogbite]

I know this is a really naive question, but what exactly did he do that justifies excommunication? I'm not at all surprised by this, and yet I sort of am. What rationalization is the church using to explain why he's being ex-ed? Don't they still try to maintain at least the illusion that a person has to have committed some kind of actual sin in order to be excommunicated?

He spoke out against the regular order as set forth from the inspired leadership. He told them their revelation is wrong. Revelation is not antigravity. It can only flow down the hill of authority, never up.

In many ways San could be considered a false prophet by the ziontologist hierarchy.

[RS Teacher]

I know this is a really naive question, but what exactly did he do that justifies excommunication? I'm not at all surprised by this, and yet I sort of am. What rationalization is the church using to explain why he's being ex-ed? Don't they still try to maintain at least the illusion that a person has to have committed some kind of actual sin in order to be excommunicated?

His letter says he was acting in opposition to the church and its leaders.

Wow! "Acting in opposition to the church and its leaders." How did I spend the better part of 50 years in this church without knowing that it was an actual sin to disagree with church leaders? I'm sickened and feel so done!

[Red Ryder]

He raised his head and said NO!

That simply goes against Mormonism and gets you kicked out. Now bow your head and say yes...

[blazerb]

It felt inevitable, yet I hoped that the LDS church would simply ignore Sam and not make him a martyr. Sam is getting the same treatment as John Dehlin because once Sam is not longer an official member, the church can hope that his cause is ignored by all right thinking Mormons. But the apostles seem determined to shoot themselves in the foot yet again and now get to enjoy being called "Ziontologists" by an increasingly vocal community.

Every time there is a visible movement in the church, I hope the same thing. It never goes that way.

[oliver_denom]

I love that the first major media story since Nelson's style guide revelation refers to Sam as a Mormon Bishop.

https://www.newsweek.com/mormon-bishop- ... ws-1096856

And the only reason this is being picked up by a big news outlet is because of the excommunication. Contrast this to Catholicism, where a Cardinal just publicly accused the Pope of personally covering up sexual abuse in a letter / press release. Will he be excommunicated? No, because somehow the Catholic Church is more progressive than Mormonism. I'm not sure when that happened.

[Corsair]

This is getting some discussion on the faithful sub of reddit. The loose concensus is that Sam is pushing an agenda and some are accusing him of acting like an ex-Mormon. His positioning and his tone were inevitably going to clash with LDS leadership. There are a lot of people who acknowledge that Sam is sincere, but also wanted to be seen as sincere. A lot of faithful members are sympathetic to Sam's cause, but do not like the way he went about it. This raises some deeply concerning questions, but I don't doubt the sincere beliefs of temple recommend holding Mormons/Ziontologists.

[Not Buying It]

Yep, we all knew this was coming. The Church doesn't give a flying flip about the damage done by their "worthiness interviews", and couldn't care less about the stories Sam has collected. They just want to shut him up.

And here's the really sad thing - they know they can excommunicate him, he will lose all credibility in the eyes of believing members, there will be a news story for a few days after they ex him, and then everyone will forget about it.

But I won't forget.

[Red Ryder]

This is the stupid normal response from TBM's

Janice Hurst
August 30, 2018 at 7:37 am
Sam, I woke up to this email this morning and thought how sad it was for you and your family. May God bless you through this process. It came as no surprise tp you as you have been talking about it for over a year. I would hope that you are honest with yourself and accept this as a beginning and not an end. You had an excellent argument for the children of the church that you turned in to a personal attack against the leadership. I know you love the children of the church, but your methods of helping them was nothing more than a witch hunt against the leadership.

You said that you fasted , but you know that in your own writings and interviews, you called it a ‘hunger’ strike. You have spoken out against the leadership on numerous occasions and documented here in your writings. You have told people NOT to join the church. I am surprised this hasn’t happened sooner. I love you Sam and you know that is true. I watched a member of my own family go through this council and it was a council of love. He came out a better person for allowing the spirit back into his life. I hope you can do the same because a man with your capacity to love others belongs in this church.

And to all of you who don’t agree with me, I don’t care. I won’t read any of your comments. This was meant for Sam, whom I have known for 30 years and adore him and Patty. It was not meant for anti LDS rantings on why anyone else doesn’t like the church.
Reply

[Mackman]

Wow. Just got done watching the videos on you tube about Sam Young mission !! I always knew their were some weird questions to kids but did not know they were that invasive , I am sickened as I am a victim myself of sexual assault as a child by my own father. Words cannot describe the horror I feel for these kids !!!! I am so glad I left the church a year ago , I was planning my return but I can see now that I would wrong to come back to institutionalized child sex abuse !!! God bless Sam Young and his efforts to bring this to light.

[jfro18]

I'm shocked they're threatening to excommunicate him. All that does is give more attention to his story and makes the church look so small and petty to toss him out for wanting explicit interviews to stop.

They are REALLY bad at managing things. Clearly this is a calculated gamble that most members won't notice or care, but they are playing with fire considering they are both claiming you need to vote against medical marijuana for the kids yet need to to excommunicate Sam who is trying to fight for the kids. So stupid.

[blazerb]

I am really trying to figure out what the church gains by excommunicating Sam rather than just ignoring him. Heck, why not cross the street to discuss the issue. TBM's don't care if that happens. They support the leaders' actions regardless. Non-members only care when there's a big spectacle. And a court of love is a spectacle that does nothing to enhance the image of the church. If the church met with him, the Trib might notice but most outlets would hardly use any space at all. Those of us on the fringes are the only ones that care, and the vast majority of us want the church to do something about the problem of youth interviews. Perhaps it would do nothing to make me believe again, but it might help those whose shelves are still holding on. In any case, it would not make me less likely to attend church. This just does not make sense.

[nibbler]

This is getting some discussion on the faithful sub of reddit.

What's interesting to me is that the criticism they have about Sam could also be said of church leaders. In fact if I didn't know that subreddit was heavily moderated I wouldn't be able to tell at a glance whether people were being critical of Sam or leaders of the church.