Life After

[Caitieep]

I was a member on this board back in 2009 but haven't posted in years, seems as if things have changed a bit! I remember this forum being such a safe haven for me when I was going through an existential crisis, I'm hoping things haven't changed too much.

I left the church in 2009 while attending UVU. There were too many questions that no one could give me answers to and most of all: I didn't like how the church preached to love everyone, but practiced loving a select group. I never asked to have my records removed, partly because it would break my mother's heart and partly because I didn't really see the benefit in doing so.

My mother is a TBM and my transition out of Mormonism definitely strained our relationship for a few years. She actually flew out to Utah and told me I had to come home with her, go to church, or be cut off financially. In my headstrong nature I chose the latter and my mom and I continued to work on our relationship. Years later our relationship is stronger than ever. It took many, many conversations to explain to my Mother why I no longer believe and for her to respect my choice. Occasionally she slips in that she wishes I would pray or at least have some relationship with God.

I've recently started going to therapy, other reasons led me to it, but last week in a session I discovered that I am still struggling with parts of Mormonism I left behind. Specifically: In the deep corners of my mind I still wonder if a) I'm not married or b) bad things happen to me because I'm not close with God in the way that I was raised to be.

I was wondering if anyone else has gone through this and how they coped with their feelings and maybe even rid their minds of it as well. Any suggestions at this point are welcome.

[trophywife26.2]

I changed my worldview about 2 years ago so I'm not as far out as you are, but I definitely struggle with that nagging feeling like something bad is happening to me because God is punishing me even though I don't believe in God anymore. It is very hard to let that go. What comforted me as a believer if I ever felt God was punishing me was to think about how God is our Heavenly Father and how what I view as a loving father wouldn't teach me lessons through punishments that were designed to cause me pain, but through things like discussion, presenting ideas, being an example, etc.

As a non-believer I mostly try to remind myself of things like statistics. If God is real, what are the chances that he is taking time out of his godly duties to punish me by having someone burglarize my car (real thing that happened) because I drank alcohol the first time (true story)!? Wouldn't God have much more important things to deal with even if he did teach through punishment, e.g. punishing people who were kidnappers and rapists?

I know a believer might say God is all knowing, all powerful, etc. so he could punish both of us without any trouble, but it just seems like an absurd waste of God's time to punish me for my so-called "sins" With all of humanity on this planet and all the good that happens and all the bad, God is concerned with the trivial mistakes and choices of my every day life?

I know there's a more generous traditional Christian grace based view of God, but it's not really part of my narrative, or in my scope of consideration.

I'm not sure if that perspective helps you at all. Meditation helps me as well. Good to hear your relationship with your mother is getting better even though it went through tough times and I'm happy to hear you are getting therapy and hope it helps you. Welcome (back) to NOM!

[EternityIsNow]

I totally relate to this stage of deprogramming having gone through that myself over the past year or two. Including the fear that there will be some dire consequence for leaving a religion that had such powerful claims and promises..

It seems like every step farther away from the religious worldview brings up new issues. Something that has helped it a lot, is learning about causality, and in particular, the theory of synchronicity, first described by Karl Jung.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Synchronicity

If you read nothing else on that wiki page, read the 'Examples' section. Here is one of the examples, of synchronicity.

The French writer Émile Deschamps claims in his memoirs that, in 1805, he was treated to some plum pudding by a stranger named Monsieur de Fontgibu. Ten years later, the writer encountered plum pudding on the menu of a Paris restaurant and wanted to order some, but the waiter told him that the last dish had already been served to another customer, who turned out to be de Fontgibu. Many years later, in 1832, Deschamps was at a dinner and once again ordered plum pudding. He recalled the earlier incident and told his friends that only de Fontgibu was missing to make the setting complete – and in the same instant, the now-senile de Fontgibu entered the room.[17]

Meaningful coincidences just seem to happen more when we are looking for them. The type of synchronicity Jung describes in that example has happened to me again and again. As a TBM I always interpreted those events according to the church's dogma of obedience/reward, disobedience/punishment. But now, I recognize these things happen to everyone. And they are hard to explain.

I believe there is a property of our universe, a force of nature, that is involved in attracting similar things together, even similar thoughts and events. I know, pretty hard to understand how this happens, but it does, and I think that is a major part of what gave this religion so much power over us. The church had an interpretation for these types of synchronistic events that locked us into a co-dependent behavior pattern that benefitted the church over our own individual needs. But in reality, these "answers to prayer" type experiences, may be just how synchronicity works.

Hang in there, both good and bad things happen to both good and bad people every day. And sometimes there are meaningful coincidences, which may simply be synchronicities. Maybe this is just how this world works.

On a related note, one thought that helps me through the deprogramming is to remember that the church did not invent anything here, they are just passing along old superstitions under new names, old mythologies repurposed for 'the latter days' as they see it. These are old ideas, old mythical worldviews used to control the subjects of past monarchs (particularly Ceaser, in the case of Christianity). But they are still just stories and myth and legend, they are fiction. The non-fiction version is that there are no special privileges from the universe for obedience to this or that religious worldview beyond ordinary cause and effect. The universe works the same for everyone, regardless of their religious or non-religious worldview.

[SeeNoEvil]

My shelf fell at age 58. My immediate reaction was of sheer fear mixed with anger. How in the heck had I been duped? I had been part of a huge con. As a BIC I knew no other way. Naturally I found myself thinking Mormon when I didn't want to... Mormon, mormon ... after all, there was no other way, right?

4 years later I resigned. Every now and then, even though I no longer believe I still get brief thoughts that worry me .... would I be punished? Was I duped by Satan as I had been taught? Had I just made the biggest mistake of my life? .... I recognized this as all part of Mormon mind control. This is abuse. If you don't educate yourself and learn what the signs are then you might not recognize it. It was imperative for me to learn more and find out just how I was duped in the first place. There are boat loads of information on the net, books, classes, and such. When you leave an abusive situation you will always have triggers and flashback.... understand it for what it is, work through it and move on. When I was doing research I saved this article. I don't know it's source but have found it helpful. It is a long list but it will open your eyes to what we experienced. For me, I needed to know how I was duped in the first place so I never fall victim to something like this again.

http://members.shaw.ca/blair_watson/symptoms.htm

[LSOF]

When bad things happen to me, I still find myself lapsing into infantile superstition, wondering whether it's God's punishment. Then I come to my senses and realise that it's only infantile superstition and fear of my own imagination.

[NOMinally Mormon]

The aftereffects of Mormonism such as guilt can be surprisingly strong. As I've eased out of church activity over the last couple of years, I didn't expect any untoward effects, because I was never completely in. However, sometimes when I was trying to achieve something--like get a new job--I would have a fleeting negative feeling, that I really didn't deserve this. This often happened back when I was active, but persisted after I quit attending. I think I've moved past this now, though. When I got a new job 2 months ago, I had no such feelings. It's kinda nice to have moved past that, but it took a while.

[Caitieep]

Thank you all for all of your kind words! It is a definitely a process, but having a little community here definitely helps!

[Zack Tacorin Dos]

I was wondering if anyone else has gone through this and how they coped with their feelings and maybe even rid their minds of it as well. Any suggestions at this point are welcome.

Caitieep,

It's normal for us to attribute agency and purpose behind events and situations we find ourselves in, even when it makes no rational sense. It's just the way we are wired. Even the most analytical, rational persons experience this. When the concept of an interceding God and an interceding devil is added to this and indoctrinated for years, it makes these feelings stronger and harder to shake.

I don't know what psychological research tells us about managing this. I only have my own experience to share, for what it's worth. I've studied critical thinking and scientific skepticism. I think it's resulted in fewer irrational thoughts and feelings that my bad behavior (as defined by the Church) has resulted in bad results via some metaphysical process. And when I do have those irrational thoughts and feelings, I have a better framework of rationally assessing the situation that seems to help me re-frame it all and not worry about "punishment" and just deal with the events and situations I don't like.

Hope you find ways to deal with this that work for you,
Zack